Kinds of Immortality [Split]

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Kinds of Immortality [Split]

Post by Khemehekis » Sun 17 Jun 2018, 22:50

Edit: Split from Fractal Federation.

elemtilas wrote:
Sun 17 Jun 2018, 17:41
Salmoneus wrote:
Sun 17 Jun 2018, 15:15
Nothing in reality can have the ability to live forever, or eternal life. You can remove aging, but there's still "being hit by a bus". Or there's "planet is destroyed in a supernova". Or there's "universe descends into an irreperable heat death". Long life, sure, but not immortality. At least, not in physics as we currently understand it.
Being hit by a bus does not preclude immortality as defined. The ability to do something is not predictive of whether that thing will be done in actuality. Also with mind transferance (and presumably archival storage!), the transience of any given physical body becomes a moot point. When you're hit by a bus, and your present iteration body dies, the medico-legal proceedings begin for the design & fabrication of a new body and the transferrance of your most recent mind-dump. You might miss a few days or weeks of actual experience while the transferrance takes place, but there will certainly a be an app that will implant up to the moment factual knowledge of current events so that you'll be able to easily catch up!
Point of order: Kankonian has two words for "immortal": heriz means an organism has the capability of living forever (but might get hit by a bus); zrivd means an organism is unkillable, cannot die. We just so happen to conflate the two concepts in the lexicon of English.
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Re: Fractal Federation

Post by sangi39 » Mon 18 Jun 2018, 00:15

Khemehekis wrote:
Sun 17 Jun 2018, 22:50
elemtilas wrote:
Sun 17 Jun 2018, 17:41
Salmoneus wrote:
Sun 17 Jun 2018, 15:15
Nothing in reality can have the ability to live forever, or eternal life. You can remove aging, but there's still "being hit by a bus". Or there's "planet is destroyed in a supernova". Or there's "universe descends into an irreperable heat death". Long life, sure, but not immortality. At least, not in physics as we currently understand it.
Being hit by a bus does not preclude immortality as defined. The ability to do something is not predictive of whether that thing will be done in actuality. Also with mind transferance (and presumably archival storage!), the transience of any given physical body becomes a moot point. When you're hit by a bus, and your present iteration body dies, the medico-legal proceedings begin for the design & fabrication of a new body and the transferrance of your most recent mind-dump. You might miss a few days or weeks of actual experience while the transferrance takes place, but there will certainly a be an app that will implant up to the moment factual knowledge of current events so that you'll be able to easily catch up!
Point of order: Kankonian has two words for "immortal": heriz means an organism has the capability of living forever (but might get hit by a bus); zrivd means an organism is unkillable, cannot die. We just so happen to conflate the two concepts in the lexicon of English.
Immortal vs. invincible?
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But it never gets any more true,
So close your eyes once more and once more believe
That they all still believe in you.
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Re: Fractal Federation

Post by Khemehekis » Mon 18 Jun 2018, 00:20

sangi39 wrote:
Mon 18 Jun 2018, 00:15
Immortal vs. invincible?
Yes, sort of. Although zrivd denotes that the organism will live forever. Needless to say, it's mostly used in fantasy, science fiction, religion, and mythology.
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Re: Fractal Federation

Post by elemtilas » Mon 18 Jun 2018, 00:36

Khemehekis wrote:
Sun 17 Jun 2018, 22:50
Point of order: Kankonian has two words for "immortal": heriz means an organism has the capability of living forever (but might get hit by a bus); zrivd means an organism is unkillable, cannot die.
An interesting distinction. And I'm now curious: in your world, are there actually / truly unkillable organisms? Such that you could drop a nuclear bomb on one and he'd not even notice? I haven't come across this same distinction in any language of The World. Queranarran, where you might expect such a distinction to be made, almost obstinately refuses to make the distinction. Daine, who have many names for death and dying, are acutely aware of the inherent mortality of everything within the universe, and including the universe itself.

Immortality lies beyond the circles of this world.
We just so happen to conflate the two concepts in the lexicon of English.
Certainly there are various usages of the word: we say that Homer is the immortal bard (with maybe Shakespeare a close second). In law, the corporation is an immortal person. But in English, I actually think the notion of immortality = unkillable to be a more recent evolution. I had a shufty in Webster's 1828, and it's pretty clear that in the (American) English of the early xix century, the concept of immortality applies first and foremost to God (who obviously is not of the physical world and thus not subject to its natural processes) and then to the human soul, which is in fact created & destined for immortal (unceasing) existence.

When I come across this other usage, I find it seems to mostly be in or derive from genres of fiction like fantasy, horror and science fiction, what with all the various monsters and gods and mondosupertechnology, such as we're seeing manifest or at least incipient in the Fractal Federation.

EDIT:
Khemehekis wrote:Yes, sort of. Although zrivd denotes that the organism will live forever. Needless to say, it's mostly used in fantasy, science fiction, religion, and mythology.
Ah, you beat me to the genre fiction angle! So, I guess that answers my question vis a vis Kankonian!
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Re: Fractal Federation

Post by Khemehekis » Mon 18 Jun 2018, 00:47

elemtilas wrote:
Mon 18 Jun 2018, 00:36
Khemehekis wrote:
Sun 17 Jun 2018, 22:50
Point of order: Kankonian has two words for "immortal": heriz means an organism has the capability of living forever (but might get hit by a bus); zrivd means an organism is unkillable, cannot die.
An interesting distinction. And I'm now curious: in your world, are there actually / truly unkillable organisms? Such that you could drop a nuclear bomb on one and he'd not even notice? I haven't come across this same distinction in any language of The World. Queranarran, where you might expect such a distinction to be made, almost obstinately refuses to make the distinction. Daine, who have many names for death and dying, are acutely aware of the inherent mortality of everything within the universe, and including the universe itself.
There aren't any such organisms. But there may be God (or perhaps gods and goddesses -- different religions of the Lehola Galaxy have different concepts of who He/She/They is/are). There have been sightings of angels, who would presumably be zrivd, but nothing flesh-and-blood (nor silicon-based) is immortal.

Do the Daine believe in an afterlife?
Immortality lies beyond the circles of this world.
The Lehola Galaxy too.
We just so happen to conflate the two concepts in the lexicon of English.
Certainly there are various usages of the word: we say that Homer is the immortal bard (with maybe Shakespeare a close second). In law, the corporation is an immortal person. But in English, I actually think the notion of immortality = unkillable to be a more recent evolution. I had a shufty in Webster's 1828, and it's pretty clear that in the (American) English of the early xix century, the concept of immortality applies first and foremost to God (who obviously is not of the physical world and thus not subject to its natural processes) and then to the human soul, which is in fact created & destined for immortal (unceasing) existence.
Kankonian has ogos for immortality in the sense of eternal fame.
EDIT:
Khemehekis wrote:Yes, sort of. Although zrivd denotes that the organism will live forever. Needless to say, it's mostly used in fantasy, science fiction, religion, and mythology.
Ah, you beat me to the genre fiction angle! So, I guess that answers my question vis a vis Kankonian!
Yes, it does.

I notice a lot of conworlders are atheists. There are also a fair number (such as Tolkien and Rowling) who are Christians. I'm a deist, so I feel free to have a conworld that has some sort of God in it (but haven't had Jesus appear to the Leholans). I don't think I've seen another deist on this board (or at least one who came out as such).
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Re: Fractal Federation

Post by elemtilas » Mon 18 Jun 2018, 02:51

Khemehekis wrote:
Mon 18 Jun 2018, 00:47
elemtilas wrote:
Mon 18 Jun 2018, 00:36
An interesting distinction. And I'm now curious: in your world, are there actually / truly unkillable organisms? Such that you could drop a nuclear bomb on one and he'd not even notice? I haven't come across this same distinction in any language of The World. Queranarran, where you might expect such a distinction to be made, almost obstinately refuses to make the distinction. Daine, who have many names for death and dying, are acutely aware of the inherent mortality of everything within the universe, and including the universe itself.
There aren't any such organisms. But there may be God (or perhaps gods and goddesses -- different religions of the Lehola Galaxy have different concepts of who He/She/They is/are). There have been sightings of angels, who would presumably be zrivd, but nothing flesh-and-blood (nor silicon-based) is immortal.
Understood.

I'll also ask about the Fractal Federation here (lest we inch any closer to hijacking this very interesting thread!) as well. What is the nature of "immortality" as the people of the FF understand it? Have they attained it? Fear losing it?
Do the Daine believe in an afterlife?
No. Nor do they "believe" in God or angels or anything of that sort.

They expect and look forward to the life after their existence in Gea. Perhaps even more longingly than they do the past that is gone.

In the vernacular understanding, yes they "believe"; but from their perspective, they would find it every bit as nonsensical to believe in something obvious and manifest as we would find it ridiculous to say we "believe" in gravity or electricity.
Immortality lies beyond the circles of this world.
The Lehola Galaxy too.
Gotcha.

And what about the world of the Fractal Federation?
Kankonian has ogos for immortality in the sense of eternal fame.
So different words for different kinds of immortality! Nice.
I notice a lot of conworlders are atheists.
Hmm. I concur, though I think it may be the case that more Atheistic geopoets are vocal about their beliefs than Theistic geopoets.
There are also a fair number (such as Tolkien and Rowling) who are Christians.
Yes. Some, like Tolkien and Lewis were more vocal; a few, like Tolkien (and perhaps myself) work from that direction; some, (maybe many?), like Rowling don't let it show much or at all in their work.
I'm a deist,
And honest to goodness Jeffersonian Deist? While I'd be fascinated to learn more about what this entails, it's certainly beyond the scope of this thread!
so I feel free to have a conworld that has some sort of God in it (but haven't had Jesus appear to the Leholans). I don't think I've seen another deist on this board (or at least one who came out as such).
I too have never met a Deist in all my sojourn here and there. I haven't met many declared Atheists either. But I may have missed the declaration! I haven't been here all that long, and many that have been here longer, I don't know those things about them.

I wouldn't expect Jesus to appear among the Leholans. Especially if they are not human. Different strokes for different folks. Even in Gea, he did not come to save everyone. Daine do not need the salvation Men do. They are unfallen. Others, like Dwarrows and Yttuun are not Men and while similarly fallen, await a different fate.
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Re: Fractal Federation

Post by eldin raigmore » Mon 18 Jun 2018, 12:42

sangi39 wrote:
Mon 18 Jun 2018, 00:15
Immortal vs. invincible?
I think you meant “invulnerable” rather than “invincible”.

“Invincible” means “unconquerable” or “can’t be beaten”.
“Invulnerable” means “can’t be wounded”.

There are other similar variations to these ideas; some of which I don’t know words for.
* Can’t die at all.
* Can’t die of old age —— other causes can still kill.
* Unkillable, but can die of old age (but not any other cause)
* Can’t be sick or sickened; in particular can’t die of disease.
* Surely some other ideas —— probably lots!

Might there be specific immunities to:
* suffocation?
* thirst?
* starvation?
* exposure?
* etc.?
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Re: Kinds of Immortality [Split]

Post by k1234567890y » Sat 23 Jun 2018, 06:32

I also have an idea of heriz humanoids...but it seems that there's no way to incorporate them into an otherwise realistic world? or there's a way?
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Re: Kinds of Immortality [Split]

Post by elemtilas » Sat 23 Jun 2018, 20:41

k1234567890y wrote:
Sat 23 Jun 2018, 06:32
I also have an idea of heriz humanoids...but it seems that there's no way to incorporate them into an otherwise realistic world? or there's a way?
What did you have in mind?
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Re: Kinds of Immortality [Split]

Post by k1234567890y » Sun 24 Jun 2018, 00:10

elemtilas wrote:
Sat 23 Jun 2018, 20:41
k1234567890y wrote:
Sat 23 Jun 2018, 06:32
I also have an idea of heriz humanoids...but it seems that there's no way to incorporate them into an otherwise realistic world? or there's a way?
What did you have in mind?
they are immune to age...maybe most diseases too, but still can get killed...although they have a faster and more effective self-repair compared to humans.

and they are going to be in my conworld.
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Re: Fractal Federation

Post by Khemehekis » Mon 25 Jun 2018, 00:56

elemtilas wrote:
Mon 18 Jun 2018, 02:51
No. Nor do they "believe" in God or angels or anything of that sort.

They expect and look forward to the life after their existence in Gea. Perhaps even more longingly than they do the past that is gone.

In the vernacular understanding, yes they "believe"; but from their perspective, they would find it every bit as nonsensical to believe in something obvious and manifest as we would find it ridiculous to say we "believe" in gravity or electricity.
I see. So the afterlife is observably real in the World! Cool!
So different words for different kinds of immortality! Nice.
Cool. Looking through my spreadsheet, I discovered another Kankonian word I forgot I had: wezhutz. "Wezhutz" is defined as "having the potential of living forever, but not unkillable". The LIE (Lehola Interplanetary English) word for this is "eternible". Heriz is more of an ambiguous word for "immortal".

LIE, in case you're wondering, is a superset of English developed in the late twentieth century in the Lehola Galaxy for writing about, and communicating with Terrans about, life in the Lehola Galaxy in English. It adds to Terran English's lexicon the names of animals, plants, foods, sports, clothing items, sapient species, religious concepts, place names, calendar terms, units of measurement, etc. that exist in the astronomy, biology and culture of the Lehola Galaxy. It also adds some Anglo-, Latin-, and Greek-based words for concepts English doesn't have words for, such as "eternible" above, or "responsibilitous". If you're responsibilitous, you take on a lot of responsibilities. If you're responsible, you take good care of the responsibilities you do have.
I notice a lot of conworlders are atheists.
Hmm. I concur, though I think it may be the case that more Atheistic geopoets are vocal about their beliefs than Theistic geopoets.
With agnostic geopoets being the least vocal of all!
Yes. Some, like Tolkien and Lewis were more vocal; a few, like Tolkien (and perhaps myself) work from that direction; some, (maybe many?), like Rowling don't let it show much or at all in their work.
As for J. K. Rowling, several years ago I checked out Conservapedia's article on Harry Potter, wondering what they would say about the book. I expected an "And then Harry Potter and all his wizard friends went straight to Hell for practicing witchcraft" screed, but was pleasantly surprised when I read this part (spoilers ahead):

http://www.conservapedia.com/index.php? ... rry_Potter
Christian Theme in Harry Potter
Spoiler warning
This article contains important plot information

Despite some criticism from mainline Christians who oppose Harry Potter for allegedly endorsing witchcraft, the series includes some aspects that parallel Christianity. Harry's death and rebirth at the end of Book VII (Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows) can be seen as mirroring the rebirth of Christ. Just as the savior of humanity was reborn, so Harry Potter, as the fictional savior of the magical world, is reborn. Further, this rebirth carries a special, significant guardianship trait: as Christ died to forgive the sins of humanity, resulting in salvation for all mankind, so Harry's death grants a protective magic to himself and to his friends. It could be said that Harry Potter teaches the nobility of meaningful sacrifice.

Praise
Spoiler warning
This article contains important plot information

The Harry Potter series has earned a lot of praise for some (but not all) of the moral messages it conveys to readers. A theme thoughout the series is Hermione Granger's fight to acheive equal rights for non-wizards, house elves in particular. However, the books also snub political correctness, shown when Hermione tries to free the house elves working at Hogwarts to no avail, who are happy and content with their job. While Hermione's attempt to raise house elves to equal status with wizards is praiseworthy, her attempts to 'free' house elves at the price of their own happiness is not.

The books also encourage readers to turn away from the temptation of evil. Throughout the series Harry is shown to have powers viewed as dark and evil, including a direct link to Voldemort's mind. Despite this, however, he is never tempted to become evil himself (as Dumbledore thought he might), similar to the way in which Jesus resisted the temptation of the Devil.
I'm a deist,
And honest to goodness Jeffersonian Deist? While I'd be fascinated to learn more about what this entails, it's certainly beyond the scope of this thread!
I'd like to start a thread on how religion has influenced the conworlding of conworlders, both published and on this board. Watch out for it!
so I feel free to have a conworld that has some sort of God in it (but haven't had Jesus appear to the Leholans). I don't think I've seen another deist on this board (or at least one who came out as such).
I too have never met a Deist in all my sojourn here and there. I haven't met many declared Atheists either. But I may have missed the declaration! I haven't been here all that long, and many that have been here longer, I don't know those things about them.
I know we have at least one person here who practices Judaism (and several others of Jewish ethnicity, including yours truly). There may be Wiccans or other Pagans here, but I can't think of any offhand. We probably have a number of agnostics, maybe even some ignostics. I don't know about Muslims or the Dharmic religions.
I wouldn't expect Jesus to appear among the Leholans. Especially if they are not human. Different strokes for different folks. Even in Gea, he did not come to save everyone. Daine do not need the salvation Men do. They are unfallen. Others, like Dwarrows and Yttuun are not Men and while similarly fallen, await a different fate.
Man, that's thoughtful, moreso than just putting "And Jesus saved everyone in the universe, of all species!"

I was thinking having Jesus appear on a planet in the Lehola Galaxy wouldn't make sense. Even on a human Lehola planet (Kankonia, Shaleya, Junsu, Shanu, etc.), this would create theological continuity problems. Christianity holds that Jesus only needed to die once to save all of humanuty. If Jesus appeared on Kankonia to save Kankonian humans, he would have to die a second death!

With the zhoar (i.e. nonhuman sapient) planets like Bodus, Querre, Hapoi, Cetonia, Saros, Tziel, Bt!a, Phadon, Stoemom, Chedma, Javarti, etc., we have an even bigger problem. If Jesus were to be reborn on one of those planets, he would be reborn as a zhoar: a Grey, a Domehead, a reptoid, a lef, an ilti, a Red, or whatever. Jesus is supposed to be human, right? (Hence your comment "Especially if they are not human".)
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Re: Fractal Federation

Post by eldin raigmore » Mon 25 Jun 2018, 03:59

Khemehekis wrote:
Mon 25 Jun 2018, 00:56
With agnostic geopoets being the least vocal of all!
I don’t know about that.
I'd like to start a thread on how religion has influenced the conworlding of conworlders, both published and on this board. Watch out for it!
If you do, I can say something about my conworlds and me.
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Re: Fractal Federation

Post by Khemehekis » Mon 25 Jun 2018, 04:01

eldin raigmore wrote:
Mon 25 Jun 2018, 03:59
Khemehekis wrote:
Mon 25 Jun 2018, 00:56
With agnostic geopoets being the least vocal of all!
I don’t know about that.
I see what you did there.
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Re: Fractal Federation

Post by elemtilas » Mon 25 Jun 2018, 17:36

Khemehekis wrote:
Mon 25 Jun 2018, 00:56
elemtilas wrote:
Mon 18 Jun 2018, 02:51
No. Nor do they "believe" in God or angels or anything of that sort.

They expect and look forward to the life after their existence in Gea. Perhaps even more longingly than they do the past that is gone.

In the vernacular understanding, yes they "believe"; but from their perspective, they would find it every bit as nonsensical to believe in something obvious and manifest as we would find it ridiculous to say we "believe" in gravity or electricity.
I see. So the afterlife is observably real in the World! Cool!
Some of these things are more manifest than others. Some people can see these things better than others. It's like a thunderstorm, the afterlife. Everyone can smell the rain, many folks can hear the thunder while some can see the flash in the sky. And a few stand in the midst of the bolt! It's real whether or not it's observed and whether or not it's believed in. Men rely much on faith. It's in their nature to believe in these things and to have hope that they will be true. Daine rely on experience. It's in their nature to feel the truth of things deep in the bones of their souls.

Observably real? There are some who have first hand knowledge of what lies beyond. Or at least a little ways beyond! The trek through the desolation, the bridge over the chasm. Those are knowns. What lies beyond the bridge? None have returned by that road! Lazarus certainly would have been one to tarry in the gardens by the bridge gate. Others may have been called to turn aside from elsewhere.

Some there are who seek those lonely roads. The diving Buddhas are such. These are boddhisatvas whose only desire is to bring out those who have fallen from the bridge: they do this by diving into the chasm themselves. Neither Man nor Daine know becomes of them once they've taken the leap!
Looking through my spreadsheet, I discovered another Kankonian word I forgot I had: wezhutz. "Wezhutz" is defined as "having the potential of living forever, but not unkillable". The LIE (Lehola Interplanetary English) word for this is "eternible". Heriz is more of an ambiguous word for "immortal".
Interesting indeed!

I think Daine would take to LIE like fish to water.

I'd like to start a thread on how religion has influenced the conworlding of conworlders, both published and on this board. Watch out for it!
Well, you know I'll be there!

I wouldn't expect Jesus to appear among the Leholans. Especially if they are not human. Different strokes for different folks. Even in Gea, he did not come to save everyone. Daine do not need the salvation Men do. They are unfallen. Others, like Dwarrows and Yttuun are not Men and while similarly fallen, await a different fate.
Man, that's thoughtful, moreso than just putting "And Jesus saved everyone in the universe, of all species!"
I think it just makes sense. Mind you, this has never stopped the Kristians of the World from prosletysing among these other peoples, and it hasn't stopped individuals from being attracted to the religion. Kind of odd, really.
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Re: Fractal Federation

Post by elemtilas » Mon 25 Jun 2018, 23:35

Khemehekis wrote:
Mon 25 Jun 2018, 00:56
I wouldn't expect Jesus to appear among the Leholans. Especially if they are not human. Different strokes for different folks. Even in Gea, he did not come to save everyone. Daine do not need the salvation Men do. They are unfallen. Others, like Dwarrows and Yttuun are not Men and while similarly fallen, await a different fate.
Man, that's thoughtful, moreso than just putting "And Jesus saved everyone in the universe, of all species!"

I was thinking having Jesus appear on a planet in the Lehola Galaxy wouldn't make sense. Even on a human Lehola planet (Kankonia, Shaleya, Junsu, Shanu, etc.), this would create theological continuity problems. Christianity holds that Jesus only needed to die once to save all of humanuty. If Jesus appeared on Kankonia to save Kankonian humans, he would have to die a second death!
An interesting puzzler, but I think you have the right of it. What would be of interest to consider is this: if there are humans on Earth and humans on Kankonia and Jesus comes among the humans of Earth, how will the humans of Kankonia know that humanity, which includes them, has been saved? It may be a long wait until humans from Earth can visit Kankonia!
With the zhoar (i.e. nonhuman sapient) planets like Bodus, Querre, Hapoi, Cetonia, Saros, Tziel, Bt!a, Phadon, Stoemom, Chedma, Javarti, etc., we have an even bigger problem. If Jesus were to be reborn on one of those planets, he would be reborn as a zhoar: a Grey, a Domehead, a reptoid, a lef, an ilti, a Red, or whatever. Jesus is supposed to be human, right? (Hence your comment "Especially if they are not human".)
Right. On this, Earth's universe and Gea's universe are in accord: when God came to live among people, it was as a Man and not as a Daine or Yttuun or Hotay or any other kind. Why that should be, no Daine can tell! And no Man either. Even the greatest of Angel kind and the mightiest of the Powers are stumped.
As for J. K. Rowling, several years ago I checked out Conservapedia's article on Harry Potter, wondering what they would say about the book. I expected an "And then Harry Potter and all his wizard friends went straight to Hell for practicing witchcraft" screed, but was pleasantly surprised when I read this part (spoilers ahead):

http://www.conservapedia.com/index.php? ... rry_Potter
Oh, there's no doubt some good, reasonably Christian values & themes are present within her work! I do think that of the three of them, those themes are more subdued and more likely to be mixed into a much more ambivalent world.

And yeah, I've always been amazed at some of the anti-HP rhetoric that has come up over the years. Though I think any "Christian message" that exists in her work's worldview is all but non-existent, it's hardly a worldview of heathendom and paganism and devil worship that some would have us believe!
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Khemehekis
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Re: Fractal Federation

Post by Khemehekis » Mon 16 Jul 2018, 04:12

elemtilas wrote:
Mon 25 Jun 2018, 23:35
An interesting puzzler, but I think you have the right of it. What would be of interest to consider is this: if there are humans on Earth and humans on Kankonia and Jesus comes among the humans of Earth, how will the humans of Kankonia know that humanity, which includes them, has been saved? It may be a long wait until humans from Earth can visit Kankonia!
Humans from Kankonia have been visiting Earth since the 1960's. Lehola planets that are members of the Interplanetary Council now have a Law of Secrecy, which forbids making a grand entrance on a planet that isn't ready to know about Lehola yet and telling the people of that planet "We are here!", but crackcreepers are permitted. Crackcreepers are low-level visitors who speak with low-level contactees (said contactees usually being ordinary people on their planets) and periodically feed them encyclopedic information about their planet and galaxy. Not everyone will take these contactees' information from the crackcreepers seriously, but when the times comes for that extra-Leholic planet to be given revelations of the whole truth by high-level Lehola visitors (Kankonians landing on the White House lawn), people won't be as surprised. There are already a few Lehola crackcreepers on Earth . . .
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elemtilas
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Re: Fractal Federation

Post by elemtilas » Tue 17 Jul 2018, 18:12

Khemehekis wrote:
Mon 16 Jul 2018, 04:12
elemtilas wrote:
Mon 25 Jun 2018, 23:35
An interesting puzzler, but I think you have the right of it. What would be of interest to consider is this: if there are humans on Earth and humans on Kankonia and Jesus comes among the humans of Earth, how will the humans of Kankonia know that humanity, which includes them, has been saved? It may be a long wait until humans from Earth can visit Kankonia!
Humans from Kankonia have been visiting Earth since the 1960's. Lehola planets that are members of the Interplanetary Council now have a Law of Secrecy, which forbids making a grand entrance on a planet that isn't ready to know about Lehola yet and telling the people of that planet "We are here!", but crackcreepers are permitted. Crackcreepers are low-level visitors who speak with low-level contactees (said contactees usually being ordinary people on their planets) and periodically feed them encyclopedic information about their planet and galaxy. Not everyone will take these contactees' information from the crackcreepers seriously, but when the times comes for that extra-Leholic planet to be given revelations of the whole truth by high-level Lehola visitors (Kankonians landing on the White House lawn), people won't be as surprised. There are already a few Lehola crackcreepers on Earth . . .
Wait.

I see what you did there! [:)]
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If we stuff the whole chicken back into the egg, will all our problems go away? --- Wandalf of Angera
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