(Conlangs) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

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Parlox
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Re: (Conlangs) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by Parlox » Sun 18 Feb 2018, 02:49

All4Ɇn wrote:
Sun 18 Feb 2018, 02:45
Parlox wrote:
Sun 18 Feb 2018, 02:41
What type of script would work best for my conlang, Abʘa? It has 96 phonemes, 10 vowels and 86 consonants. I would rather not use a logography.
What syllable structure does it have? If it's relatively simple, I think a syllabary could be interesting to use
(C)(C)(C)(C)(V)(C), though anything beyond (C)(C)(V(C) is very rare. CV(C) and CCV are the most common. I might change it to a (C)V(C) order though, i don't think i like the huge syllables that are possible.
  • :con: Bàsupan, (Coming soon)
  • :con: Stellendor
  • :con: Chavajau,
  • :con: Oddúhath Claire,
  • :con: Molvanian,
  • :con: Some temporary toylangs such as Rh'ae, Brythónnyc Claire, and Koe'ez.
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Re: (Conlangs) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by All4Ɇn » Sun 18 Feb 2018, 03:37

Parlox wrote:
Sun 18 Feb 2018, 02:49
C)(C)(C)(C)(V)(C), though anything beyond (C)(C)(V(C) is very rare. CV(C) and CCV are the most common. I might change it to a (C)V(C) order though, i don't think i like the huge syllables that are possible.
If you change it to (C)V(C) a syllabary would definitely be a great idea for it!
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Re: (Conlangs) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by Parlox » Sun 18 Feb 2018, 03:44

All4Ɇn wrote:
Sun 18 Feb 2018, 03:37
If you change it to (C)V(C) a syllabary would definitely be a great idea for it!
I think i will, thanks! I'm not sure how i'll stay sane while creating over 800 characters.
  • :con: Bàsupan, (Coming soon)
  • :con: Stellendor
  • :con: Chavajau,
  • :con: Oddúhath Claire,
  • :con: Molvanian,
  • :con: Some temporary toylangs such as Rh'ae, Brythónnyc Claire, and Koe'ez.
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Re: (Conlangs) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by ixals » Sun 18 Feb 2018, 03:57

Parlox wrote:
Sun 18 Feb 2018, 03:44
All4Ɇn wrote:
Sun 18 Feb 2018, 03:37
If you change it to (C)V(C) a syllabary would definitely be a great idea for it!
I think i will, thanks! I'm not sure how i'll stay sane while creating over 800 characters.
Maybe a Hangul-like system could work as well? Every syllable would have its own character but you only need to create 96 pieces that can be combined.
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Re: (Conlangs) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by Parlox » Sun 18 Feb 2018, 04:07

ixals wrote:
Sun 18 Feb 2018, 03:57
Maybe a Hangul-like system could work as well? Every syllable would have its own character but you only need to create 96 pieces that can be combined.
Yeah i'll do that, but i'll make a syllabary for an older version of the language.
  • :con: Bàsupan, (Coming soon)
  • :con: Stellendor
  • :con: Chavajau,
  • :con: Oddúhath Claire,
  • :con: Molvanian,
  • :con: Some temporary toylangs such as Rh'ae, Brythónnyc Claire, and Koe'ez.
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Re: (Conlangs) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by Pabappa » Sun 18 Feb 2018, 05:26

Wouldn't it need 73,960 characters? Or are the codas more restrictive?

Either that, or the codas can be given standalone consonant signs... but that wouldn't be a true syllabary.

I like the hangul idea.
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Re: (Conlangs) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by All4Ɇn » Sun 18 Feb 2018, 06:03

Parlox wrote:
Sun 18 Feb 2018, 04:07
ixals wrote:
Sun 18 Feb 2018, 03:57
Maybe a Hangul-like system could work as well? Every syllable would have its own character but you only need to create 96 pieces that can be combined.
Yeah i'll do that, but i'll make a syllabary for an older version of the language.

You could also do something similar to Canada's syllabary or ten-ten in Japanese where you wouldn't truly have to create over 800 characters
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Re: (Conlangs) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by Zekoslav » Sun 18 Feb 2018, 12:12

Ahzoh wrote:
Thu 15 Feb 2018, 19:24
Suppose my proto-language has agent markers -a and -an and patient markers -eo and -igu:
How easy would it be for just -a and -an to replace -eo and -igu and as such now mark both agent and patient, without undergoing phonological change?
What is the morphosyntactic alignment of your language? I can imagine this happening most easily if the language switches to ergative alignment, the former agent case being reinterpreted as absolutive, which then replaces the former patient case as well - with the ergative case being an innovation.

Most cases of agent and/or patient case replacing one another that I know of happened during the breakdown of the case system - and then, the patient case replaces the agent case more often than the opposite. Anyway, I am extra-careful (maybe too careful) when considering the probability of a diachronic change, and I need to broaden my knowledge of language diversity. You don't need to be constrained by this at all.
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Re: (Conlangs) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by Omzinesý » Mon 19 Feb 2018, 18:54

I'm making a new lang. Its declensions are below. They are a bit too similar and agglutinative. How to make them more different? Ideas?

Geminate stem with /i/

NOM sap
ACC sappi
GEN sapping
INSTR sappil

Geminate stem with /a/
NOM tor
ACC torra
GEN torrang
INSTR torral

Non-geminated stem with /i/
NOM vo:si
ACC vo:si
GEN vo:sing
INSTR vos:il

Non-geminated stem with /a/
NOM me:la
ACC me:la
GEN me:lang
INSTR me:lal
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Re: (Conlangs) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by Parlox » Mon 19 Feb 2018, 20:39

I've been working on a 3Cons language, and i have a question. Should i store the derivations of a root in the lexicon or just the root?
  • :con: Bàsupan, (Coming soon)
  • :con: Stellendor
  • :con: Chavajau,
  • :con: Oddúhath Claire,
  • :con: Molvanian,
  • :con: Some temporary toylangs such as Rh'ae, Brythónnyc Claire, and Koe'ez.
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Re: (Conlangs) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by Creyeditor » Tue 20 Feb 2018, 10:17

For the sake of the user-experience, please include the derivations [:)]
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Re: (Conlangs) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by Parlox » Tue 20 Feb 2018, 22:01

Creyeditor wrote:
Tue 20 Feb 2018, 10:17
For the sake of the user-experience, please include the derivations [:)]
Ok.

Quick question, what are some interesting ways to handle adjectives? I want to get rid of adjectives in Abʘa but i don't have any ideas. I would prefer not to use verbs for this purpose, most of my conlangs already use this method.
  • :con: Bàsupan, (Coming soon)
  • :con: Stellendor
  • :con: Chavajau,
  • :con: Oddúhath Claire,
  • :con: Molvanian,
  • :con: Some temporary toylangs such as Rh'ae, Brythónnyc Claire, and Koe'ez.
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Re: (Conlangs) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by Parlox » Tue 20 Feb 2018, 22:06

Sorry for the double post, but i have another question. What could i use to replace prepositions or postpositions besides grammatical case?
  • :con: Bàsupan, (Coming soon)
  • :con: Stellendor
  • :con: Chavajau,
  • :con: Oddúhath Claire,
  • :con: Molvanian,
  • :con: Some temporary toylangs such as Rh'ae, Brythónnyc Claire, and Koe'ez.
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Re: (Conlangs) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by Creyeditor » Tue 20 Feb 2018, 22:49

Relational nouns (on the top of, on the inside of, etc. ) and coverbs (entering, etc) come to mind for adpositions.
Properties can also be expressed by nouns in a possessive-like construction (man of greatness = great man, or also greatness of man=great man). Instrumental contruction comes to mind, at least that sounds very matural to my ears (man with greatness, etc.). So far for properties being nouns. If you allow for other parts of speech, you can also derive them from these. Maybe one could use adverbs in a way, something like "man, who does well"="good man"? Doesn't sound to far fetched.
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Re: (Conlangs) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by Parlox » Tue 20 Feb 2018, 22:55

I really like the genitive and instrumental constructions! Thanks for the suggestions.
  • :con: Bàsupan, (Coming soon)
  • :con: Stellendor
  • :con: Chavajau,
  • :con: Oddúhath Claire,
  • :con: Molvanian,
  • :con: Some temporary toylangs such as Rh'ae, Brythónnyc Claire, and Koe'ez.
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Re: (Conlangs) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by Parlox » Wed 21 Feb 2018, 05:38

I'm sorry for the double-post, it should be the last time.

What are some interesting ways to express modality? I only know of auxiliary verbs and moods, but surely there must be another method?
Edit: One more thing, are there any languages without conjunctions?
  • :con: Bàsupan, (Coming soon)
  • :con: Stellendor
  • :con: Chavajau,
  • :con: Oddúhath Claire,
  • :con: Molvanian,
  • :con: Some temporary toylangs such as Rh'ae, Brythónnyc Claire, and Koe'ez.
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Re: (Conlangs) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by Creyeditor » Wed 21 Feb 2018, 12:58

The most interesting thing I know about modality is not expressing it or merging several categories. There are languages with a general deontic suffix, that can mean 'allow' or 'obligation'. You should really read up on different modality categories and how they cooccur. Some language contrast ability vs. allowance vs. possibility, some merge several of these, etc.


My general answer to both of your questions is: verbal affixes. Conjunctions can be expressed as verbal affixes. You just have to make sure you cut up the semantic space a bit different from English. 'and' for example has a number of meanings, why not split them up. There are several ways to express a reason. Why not merge them. Also why not merge temporal and non-temporal conjunctions in a different way?

Another way is always periphrastic constructions, but these might gut a bit clunky (I like you, the reason for this is: you are smart)
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Re: (Conlangs) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by Pabappa » Wed 21 Feb 2018, 17:26

Is there a term for an inflectional paradigm that is a composite of two previously independent paradigms? Like in Latin where the accusative plural from one declension is borrowed into another. Basically the opposite of syncretism .... The idea is to preserve differences that would normally be eroded by sound changes.
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Re: (Conlangs) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by Pabappa » Wed 21 Feb 2018, 17:34

Parlox wrote:
Wed 21 Feb 2018, 05:38
Edit: One more thing, are there any languages without conjunctions?
presumably inuktitut and similarly polysynthetic languages would count, since the conjunction s would need to be inflected as verbs. By the same token, my conlangs ate *almost* free of conjunction s... but I decided to keep "and, if, but , or" as particles .... they could be considered irregular verbs... but I prefer to treat them as a separate part of speech, even though there are only 4 of them. Helps that Poswa/ Pabappa/ etc are verb-final, and conjunction s always appear at the beginning of their clause.
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Re: (Conlangs) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by shimobaatar » Wed 21 Feb 2018, 17:35

Pabappa wrote:
Wed 21 Feb 2018, 17:26
Is there a term for an inflectional paradigm that is a composite of two previously independent paradigms? Like in Latin where the accusative plural from one declension is borrowed into another. Basically the opposite of syncretism .... The idea is to preserve differences that would normally be eroded by sound changes.
Suppletive, maybe? I'm not entirely sure I understand the situation you're describing, but that's what I'd call "an inflectional paradigm that is a composite of two previously independent paradigms".
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