Zatulbar: my miserable Turk-lang

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Jonnyboi17
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Zatulbar: my miserable Turk-lang

Post by Jonnyboi17 » Thu 15 Feb 2018, 14:19

Hey, it’s been a while (like a year) since I posted anything, but I have this language I started creating since high school (I’m in college now, the language was started almost a year ago). What got me to create this language was when I was thinking about verb conjugations in Spanish, and I thought, maybe I could create a language in which pronouns and maybe nouns are connected to the ends of verbs? Hence I created Zatulbar ^^.
Ok lemme get into the basics:
Consonants
/p t k b d g/ p t k b d g
/m n ɲ ŋ/ m n ny ng
/f s ʃ ʧ h x/ f s ş ç h -h*
/v z ʒ ʤ/ v z j c
/r~ɾ l j w/ r l y w

Vowels
/i y ɯ u/i ü ı u
/e œ o/e ö o
/a æ/ a ä
If your familiar with Turkish, you can see that the orthography is exactly like it.
Some Grammar
I don’t have much time rn, but I’ll post some grammar to show how I conjugate verbs, how nouns behave, etc.
Verbs
•Verbs can be any word, but basic ones are usually one to two syllables. Verbs must always end with certain vowels to mark tense:
a-present tense
e/i- past tense
ö/o- future tense
I need to work on what determines the verb to have an e or i in past tense, and an ö or o in the future tense.
Pronouns go onto the ends of the verbs:
1st sing.: -m-
2nd sing.: -t-
3rd sing.: -s-
1st plu.: -n-
2nd plu.: -f-
3rd plu.: -r-
Neuter sing.: -k-
Neuter plu.: -ki
These are the conjugations for subject pronouns, here are the conjugations for object pronouns:
1st sing.: -mi
2nd sing.: -ti
3rd sing.: -si
1st plu.: -ni
2nd plu.: -fi
3rd plu.: -li
Neuter sing.: -g-
Neuter plu.: -gi
Here is a few example sentences demonstrating how to use these conjugations:
Ha= to have
Ha-m-ki
Hamki.
“I have it.”
Eva= to love
Eva-m-ti
Evamti.
“I love you.”
Ok that is all I have time for now, tell me what you guys think ^^.
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Vlürch
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Re: Zatulbar: my miserable Turk-lang

Post by Vlürch » Thu 15 Feb 2018, 16:32

Please don't take this post as criticism. It's not. If you already know all this and I come across as a jerk, sorry; I probably misunderstood something about what your intent with this language is. Also a disclaimer: I'm not a Turkic expert or anything, I just really like Turkic languages and am trying to learn several of them.

Anyway, as far as I can tell, your conlang doesn't really have any distinctly Turkic features apart from the orthography (and even that's not necessarily exclusively Turkic). Also, you said the orthography is exactly like Turkish; Turkish doesn't have <ny>, <ng> and <w> because it doesn't have /ɲ/, /ŋ/ and /w/. Anyway, if you meant that it's heavily influenced by Turkish (and possibly other Turkic languages that do have those sounds), vowel harmony would make that a lot more obvious.

Here's how Turkish vowel harmony works:
Back unrounded: /ɑ ɯ/
Back rounded: /o u/
Front unrounded: /e i/
Front rounded: /ø y/

As a general rule, back vowels and front vowels can't coexist in the same word (although loanwords are an exception). The vowels in the stem determine the vowels in the inflections. For example:
Back unrounded: kadın (woman) / kadının (woman's) / kadınlarımız (our women) / kadınlarımızın (our women's)
Back rounded: ordu (army) / ordun (army's) / ordumuz (our army) / ordumuzun (our army's)
Front unrounded: dil (language) / dilin (language's) / dillerimiz (our languages) / dillerimizin (of our languages)
Front rounded: örgüt (organisation) / örgütün (organisation's) / örgütümüz (our organisation) / örgütümüzün (our organisation's)

In Turkish, however, the plurals and certain other inflections are always unrounded. In some other Turkic languages, like Kyrgyz and Sakha/Yakut, there still is rounding harmony.

For example, in Kyrgyz:
Back unrounded: аял (woman) / аялдын (woman's) / аялдар (women) / аялдардын (women's)
Back rounded: тоо (mountain) / тоонун (mountain's) / тоолор (mountains) / тоолордун (of mountains)
Front unrounded: тиш (tooth) / тиштин (tooth's) / тиштер (teeth) / тиштердин (of teeth)
Front rounded: көл (lake) / көлдүн (lake's) / көлдөр (lakes) / көлдөрдүн (of lakes)

It's also possible to lose phonemic vowel harmony, like Uzbek has done. In that case, however, the distinction between /ɑ e/, /ɯ i/, /o ø/ and /u y/ would probably have been lost at least orthographically even if they remained as allophones (like in Uzbek at least to some degree). On the other hand, Turkish is different from some other Turkic languages in that it has lost the distinction between /e/ and /æ/. Kazakh, for example, still distinguishes them, although they have no effect on vowel harmony since both are front unrounded.

...so, all this is a long-winded way of saying: if you want the o/ö alteration to be based on Turkic languages, they would be determined by the backness of the vowels in the stem (or at least the last vowel).

~

It being polypersonal, suffixing both the subject and object in the verb, is nice. I really like how concise it is with that, too! [:D]
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Re: Zatulbar: my miserable Turk-lang

Post by Jonnyboi17 » Thu 15 Feb 2018, 22:19

Oooohhh yeah by Turkic I meant it is phonologically Turkic in form. The lexicon also includes some Turkish and Arabic words, but I made them sound a tad bit different from the original languages.
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Re: Zatulbar: my “miserable” Turk-lang

Post by Jonnyboi17 » Fri 16 Feb 2018, 04:47

Sorry, just wanted to change the name. The reason why I consider it to be “miserable” is because I am stuck on where to continue with the lang.
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Re: Zatulbar: my miserable Turk-lang

Post by Jonnyboi17 » Fri 23 Feb 2018, 01:50

I think I’ll post some more on this language.
Aspect:
Aspect is conjugated on the front of the verb:
Perfect= ä(n)
Imperfect= ba-
Subjunctive= zo-
Conditional= pe-
Command= sal-
Mood:
Mood is also conjugated on the front of the verb:
Optative= şau(l)-
Imperative= dua(h)-
Potential= tim-
Hypothetical= ır-
Deontic modality= fah-
Note: Hypothetical translates to the auxiliary word “could” in English. Deontic modality translates to the auxiliary “should” In English.
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Re: Zatulbar: my miserable Turk-lang

Post by Creyeditor » Fri 23 Feb 2018, 10:33

What is the order of mood and aspect affixes? Can all of them cooccur?
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Re: Zatulbar: my miserable Turk-lang

Post by Jonnyboi17 » Tue 27 Feb 2018, 20:43

Creyeditor wrote:
Fri 23 Feb 2018, 10:33
What is the order of mood and aspect affixes? Can all of them cooccur?
I should research it mood and aspect could occur together, in this case the languages can have both be conjugated.
The structure for verbs is as follows:
mood-aspect-root-tense-subject pronoun- object pronoun
*of course everything except root and tense are optional.
*the most simplest construction for a verb would be root-tense. A verb is always conjugated for tense, all others are optional.
*the only time a verb would stand in its most basic form is if there is no pronouns in the sentence.
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