Boral scratchpad - romlang

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Boral scratchpad - romlang

Post by Jackk » Sun 19 Aug 2018, 19:49

I thought I'd make a new thread for ramblings about my Romance conlang, since it has evolved in many ways since I last wrote anything down about it. The old thread can be found here. Questions, corrections and comments will always be appreciated. [:D]

Context:
In what we know as the North Sea there is a medium-sized land with roughly twice the land area of Wales. Known to the Romans as Īnsula Boreālis - The Island in the North - it was absorbed into the Empire soon after Britain. Isl Borail weathered several invasions, especially through the remainder of the first millenium. Nevertheless, it's native Romance language has persisted to the modern day, known here as Boral.
Actual details about the language in later posts, but for now a quote:
  • Casc human nasc libr e eval de digndað e d'innað. L'es de raçon e de conscienç forni, e lour fal l'un a l'autr agir con sen de fraterndað.
[ˌkaɣiˈman nax ˌlibʁe ʔeˈval də dajnˈdaðe dɪnˈnaθ ‖ lɛs də ʁaˈʣɔn e də konˈʃɛnʦ fɔɐ̯ˈni | e luɐ̯ ˌfal lina ˌlot aˈʒɪɐ̯ kɔn ˌsɛn də ˌfʁatɛɐ̯nˈdaθ]
Last edited by Jackk on Thu 23 Aug 2018, 21:50, edited 4 times in total.
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Boral scratchpad

Post by Jackk » Sun 19 Aug 2018, 21:17

One sentence - an in-depth analysis

Let's look at the phonology and grammar of Boral by looking at one example sentence:

T'a fini par l'eç cauçur acatar ou ?
Did you end up buying these shoes?
Pronunciation:
/ta fiˈni paʁ ˌleʦ koˈʦiʁ ˌakaˈtaʁ u/
[ta fiˈni pɑː ˌlɛs koˈʣɪːʁ‿ak(ə)ˈtɑːʁ‿u]

Gloss:
tu a fin-i par l-eç cauçur acat-ar ou
2s have-2s.prs.ind end-ptcp.pf def-pl.prx shoe buy-inf Q
Phonetic notes:
  • Boral is part of the sprachbund which backed former /r/, having a uvular fricative, which may weaken to [ɐ̯] or even disappear entirely in coda position before a consonant (see par above).
  • Latin /uː/ fronted very quickly to /yː/ in Old Boral and subsequently unrounded to /iː/, and since then has been indistinguishable from descendants of Latin /i:/ (see cauçur).
  • Word-level stress falls almost universally on the final syllable, barring marginal cases with final /ʁ/ following a consonant.
  • Vowels do not typically undergo reduction in unstressed position, the most notable exception being the pretonic vowel in words of three or more syllables, which becomes schwa or vanishes in all but the most careful speech.
  • Boral shares many features with Gallo-Romance in general and more with Norman French in particular; a good example of this is acatar "buy" < VLt. *accaptare, which is cognate with French acheter [aʃˈte] and Norman acater [ˌakaˈte]. We see that Boral did not undergo the secondary palatalisation of /k g/ before /a/ as Standard French did.
  • Another example of the above is the infinitival ending -ar. Although Boral shares the /er > ar/ change with French - see marcað < Lt. mercatus or par < Lt. per - it lacks the similar /ar > er/ change, whence mar < Lt. mare "sea" > Fr. mer.

Morphology & Syntax:
  • In the early stages, the language suffered the same loss of final consonants as the neighbours dialects of Vulgar Latin, but with an important difference - the further loss of final /s/. The relevant consequence of this here is that Boral no longer marks plural at all on its nouns (see French, although there the distinction is retained in writing as the loss of final /s/ occurred rather later). For example, cauçur ( < Lt. calceāre "put on shoes" + -ur a nominaliser) serves for both the singular "shoe" and the plural "shoes".
  • One way the language remains able to mark number is through its determiners, which developed early on to compensate for losing the distinction on nouns.
    • oc [ɔk] "this" < Lt. hoc
    • [ɛʦ] "these" < Lt. haec (or possibly ecce - records are inconsistent)
    • ig [aj] "that" < Lt. ibi
    • ci [ʦi] "those" < Lt. ecce ibi
    Notice that these almost always appear with the definite article y / l'. For example,
    Il desirn y ci pom. They want those apples.
  • Like French, Boral has developed several compound tenses to supplement those descending directly from Latin. Among these is the passað proism [paˌsaθ ˈpʁoj.zm̩], the near past, constructed using a form of aïr "have" < Lt. habēre, plus the past participle of the verb, as seen above.
  • The word order is unusual for a Romance language, influenced by its Germanic neighbours. Though Boral is by default SVO, participle forms of verbs tend to follow their direct object, in a way roughly analogous to German's V2 behaviour.
    J'ay dey letr scrit. I have written ten letters.
  • The sentence-final particle ou < Lt. aut "or" marks questions, usually accompanied by a rise in pitch. This strategy is an innovation, not usually occurring in any of the language's neighbours.
Last edited by Jackk on Tue 21 Aug 2018, 21:29, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: Boral scratchpad - romlang

Post by k1234567890y » Mon 20 Aug 2018, 05:06

nice (:

what is the etymology of ou "question particle" though?
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Re: Boral scratchpad - romlang

Post by DesEsseintes » Mon 20 Aug 2018, 08:10

Yay, you started a thread! [:D]

I like the look of this, in particular the French-yet-not-at-all-French-ness of it, and your explanations are clear and fun.

Look forward to more!
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Re: Boral scratchpad - romlang

Post by Jackk » Mon 20 Aug 2018, 14:10

Thanks for the compliments, people [:D]

(Feedback strictly increases the probability of more posts [:P] )
k1234567890y wrote:
Mon 20 Aug 2018, 05:06
what is the etymology of ou "question particle" though?
Boral ou is cognate to f.ex. French ou, Spanish o < Lt. aut "or". The semantic shift of "or > question particle" is attested in several languages (although not in Romance to my knowledge) and is even found in colloquial English: You want a drink, or?
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Re: Boral scratchpad - romlang

Post by k1234567890y » Mon 20 Aug 2018, 14:26

Jackk wrote:
Mon 20 Aug 2018, 14:10
Thanks for the compliments, people [:D]

(Feedback strictly increases the probability of more posts [:P] )
k1234567890y wrote:
Mon 20 Aug 2018, 05:06
what is the etymology of ou "question particle" though?
Boral ou is cognate to f.ex. French ou, Spanish o < Lt. aut "or". The semantic shift of "or > question particle" is attested in several languages (although not in Romance to my knowledge) and is even found in colloquial English: You want a drink, or?
nice (: I think I have done something similar in one of my langs
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Re: Boral scratchpad - romlang

Post by Jackk » Mon 20 Aug 2018, 14:50

Sound changes - an example of an regular -ar verb

Consider desirar [ˌdez(ə)ˈʁɑɐ̯] "want" < Lt. dēsīderāre, which is typical of such verbs.

deːˌsiː.deˈraːre - the usual Vulgar Latin pronunciation

> deˌsi.ðəˈra.rə
  • Loss of length usual for Western Romance, along with some further reduction of the pre-tonic and post-tonic vowels
  • First stage of intervocalic lenition: [p t k b d g > b d g β ð ɣ] between vowels
> deˌsiːˈrar
  • Second stage of intervocalic lenition: [b d g β ð ɣ > v ð j ∅] between vowels
  • Complete loss of schwa and schwi in all contexts with sporadic compensatory lengthening
> ˌde.ziˈrar
  • Reanalysis of stress to regularise iambic pattern, with consequent loss of length in pre-tonic position
  • Voicing of fricatives between vowels
> ˌde.zɨˈʀaʀ > ˌdez(ə)ˈʁɑɐ̯
  • Backing of the rhotic - an areal change influenced by neighbouring Romance and Germanic languages
  • Centralisation of pre-tonic vowels in words of at least three syllables (and then loss in informal registers)
  • Subsequent weakening of coda [ʁ]
Let's have a look at the present d'y indicatif forms of desirar as they exemplify verbs of this type.
jo desir, tu desir, i desir; nos desirau, vos desirað, il desirn
[ˌʒo deˈzɪɐ̯ | ˌti deˈzɪɐ̯ | ˌi deˈzɪɐ̯ ‖ ˌno dezˈʁo | ˌvo dezˈʁaθ | ˌi deˈzi ʁn̩]

Notes
  • Losing final /s/ along with final /t/, and then reducing final vowels results in the following:
    deːˈsiː.de.roː deːˈsiː.de.ras deːˈsiː.de.raːt > deˈsi.ðərə deˈsi.ðərə deˈsi.ðərə
    deːˌsiː.deˈraːmus deːˈsiː.de.raːtis deːˈsiː.de.rant > deˌsi.ðəˈraβʷə deˈsi.ðəˈradə deˈsi.ðərən
    • Already the singular conjugation has collapsed into a single form - Boral was one of the first Romance language of the region to mandate the use of the subject pronouns (at the time written io tu il nos vos ilo).
    • The shift of [m > βʷ] in the nos form is not a case of a general rule but appears to be specific to the verb endings -amus -emus -imus, presumably due to the frequent use.
    • In reducing to schwa [iː] would usually palatalise the preceding consonant, while [u uː] would labialise it. One exception is the ending -um which was already [ʊ̃] in VL and had lowered further to something like [õ] before this change occurred.
    • We already see the split on primary stress between the nos vos forms and the rest, which will be emblematic of many Boral paradiigms.
  • It is actually not too difficult now to trace the changes from this point to the educated present forms:
    deˈsi.ðərə > deˈzɪʁ
    deˌsi.ðəˈraβʷə deˈsi.ðəˈradʲə deˈsi.ðərən > de.ziˈʁo de.ziˈʁaθ deˈzi.ʁn̩
    • [aβʷ] quickly becomes [aw], and then smooths to [o] along with all other [aw], whether from Lt. /au/ or VL [aɫ].
    • The devoicing [ð > θ] in the vos form is an example of a general process where all final consonant are devoiced.
That should explain most everything - do say if anything is unclear. [:D]
Last edited by Jackk on Mon 27 Aug 2018, 15:27, edited 5 times in total.
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Post by Jackk » Mon 20 Aug 2018, 19:35

Waterfalls and châteaux: a case study

Here we look at two words which are pronounced almost identically in casual speech, but which have rather different stories.
[kasˈtɛl] vs [kaxˈtɛl]
[kasˈtɛl] castel is perhaps easier, having not changed appreciably in pronunciation for over a millennium. It is derived from Latin castellum and still means "castle", cognate to Jérriais câté, French château, and Portuguese castelo, among many others.

[kaxˈtɛl], spelt cascatel and pronounced [ˌka.xaˈtɛl] in careful speech, is not so simple. It splits into two pieces: [kaˈxat] cascat, meaning waterfall and being borrowed directly from Mediæval Italian cascata, and [ɛl] -el, a suffix which forms diminutives descending ultimately from Latin -ellum.
So it's a word meaning little waterfall and in Boral it means a shower. For example:

L'homr nun castel vivent lava ses a cascatel.
The man who lived in a castle was showering.
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Re: Boral scratchpad - romlang

Post by Jackk » Tue 21 Aug 2018, 13:26

Y Catr Saçon
  1. hiern "winter"
    [jɛɐ̯n] - descends directly from Lt. hibernus. Note that it retains the final [n], as in jorn [ʒɔɐ̯n] "daytime", as opposed to Fr. hiver, jour.
  2. prinveir "spring"
    [pʁɪɱˈviɐ̯] - from VLt. primavera, literally "first spring", since vera had shifted in meaning to "summer". Cognates include Rom. primăvară and Occit. primver.
  3. stað "summer"
    [staθ] - like Fr. été, descending ultimately from Lt. aestatem, through intermediate estað. The initial <e> was lost when Boral lost all initial <e> before sC sequences; those which had previously been added in front of VL sC- and those which had always been there.
  4. harvest "autumn"
    [hɑɐ̯ˈvɛs(t)] - a borrowing from Old English hærfest with the same meaning. This is an example of a word which reintroduced the phoneme /h/ into Boral after it had been lost in Proto-Romance. Note that in some dialects (predominantly Northeastern) the word is instead haust, either a later reduction of harvest or a direct borrowing from Old Norse haustr.
Image
Last edited by Jackk on Thu 23 Aug 2018, 21:51, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Boral scratchpad - romlang

Post by Jackk » Tue 21 Aug 2018, 15:53

Examples, with audio.
  • L'eç arbr reman noc vert a hiern.
    These trees do not stay green in winter. 📣
  • J'ador y ci agnel de prinveir spiar.
    I love watching the springtime lambs. 📣
  • La n'es sen a ni mar naugar for a mi-stað.
    Only in midsummer is it sensible to swim in the sea. 📣
  • Nos faim retor a l'universtað l'oc harvest.
    We go back to university this autumn. 📣
Spoiler:
  1. /lɛʦ ˌaʁbʁ ʁeˈman nɔk ˌvɛʁt a ˈjɛʁn/
    [lɛˌʣɑɐ̯bə ʁeˈmanːɔk ˌvɛɐ̯t a ˈjɛɐ̯n]
    l'-ec arbr reman noc vert a hiern
    def prx.pl stay neg green at winter
  2. /ʒaˌdɔʁ i ˌʦi ajˈnɛl də pʁɪnˌviʁ spiˈaʁ/
    [ʒaˌdɔʁ‿i ʣjajˈnɛl də pʁɪɱˌviɐ̯ spiˈjɑɐ̯]
    j'-ador y ci agnel de prinveir spi-ar
    1s.sbj love def dst.pl lamb of spring watch
  3. /ˌla nɛs ˈsɛn a ni ˌmaʁ noˈgaʁ fɔʁ ˌa miˈstaθ/
    [ˌlanɛs ˈsɛn a ni ˌmaɐ̯ noˈgɑɐ̯ fɔˌʁ‿a miˈstaθ]
    la n'-es sen a n-i mar naug-ar for a mi-stað
    there neg-be.3s sense at in-def sea swim-inf only at mid-summer
  4. /no ˌfem ʁeˈtɔʁ a liˌnivɛʁˈstaθ lɔk haʁˈvɛst/
    [no ˌfem ʁeˈtɔʁ‿a liˌnivɛɐ̯ˈstaθ lɔk hɑɐ̯ˈvɛs]
    nos fai-m retor a l'-universtað l'oc harvest
    1p.sbj do.1p return to def university def prx.sg autumn
Last edited by Jackk on Thu 23 Aug 2018, 21:53, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Boral scratchpad - romlang

Post by Zekoslav » Wed 22 Aug 2018, 11:10

This language is a beauty, and quite creative as well - as a student of French, I like the ways it's both similar to and different from it. Looking at the last incarnation, I see you managed to flesh it out quite well [:D]. Also, the presentation is awesome - I wish I could present my conlang like that!
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:hrv: [:D], :bih: :srb: [;)], :eng: [:D], :fra: [:|], :lat: [:(], :deu: [:'(]

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Re: Boral scratchpad - romlang

Post by Jackk » Wed 22 Aug 2018, 13:57

Zekoslav wrote:
Wed 22 Aug 2018, 11:10
This language is a beauty, and quite creative as well - as a student of French, I like the ways it's both similar to and different from it. Looking at the last incarnation, I see you managed to flesh it out quite well. Also, the presentation is awesome - I wish I could present my conlang like that!
Thank you! I definitely take the plurality of my inspiration from French, as the only (non-English) language I consider myself fluent in.

Yeah the older version is quite different but I feel like the core ideas and æsthetic have held over. [:)]

What aspect of the presentation do you like the most? I'd love to know exactly what I'm doing right so I can do more of it. [:D]
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Re: Boral scratchpad - romlang

Post by Zekoslav » Wed 22 Aug 2018, 14:38

It's the creative use of the typeset, as well as the laidback, story-like style where you present snippets of your language (the "Chaque mot a son histoire"-style, if you get what I mean). In comparison, the presentation of my conlang looks extremely dry and technical.
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Re: Boral scratchpad - romlang

Post by gestaltist » Wed 22 Aug 2018, 14:55

I like what I'm seeing, and you really have a knack for explaining things. A pleasant read. Keep it coming.
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Re: Boral scratchpad - romlang

Post by Jackk » Wed 22 Aug 2018, 14:55

Sorry not sorry: apology in Boral

Boral has several ways to express apology.
  1. nafrað
    /nafʁaθ/ - by far the most common method of saying sorry. Cognate to Fr. navré "saddened", it descends from Old Boral nafrar or perhaps directly from Old Fr. nafré "injured through cutting", from Old Norse nafra "to pierce or bore with an auger".
  2. pardon
    /paʁˈdɔn/ - used primarily in more formal contexts, more similar in connotation to English "excuse me". Either a deverbal of pardonar "to forgive" or borrowed from Old Fr. pardon "forgiveness", all from VLt. perdōnō with the same meaning.
  3. m'il sorc
    /miˈsɔʁk/ - literally "my sadness", used often to express sympathy rather than apology but is used more generally in the rural Western dialects. The word sorc is an old borrowing from either Old Eng. or Old Norse sorg "sorrow" (records are unclear).
  4. desolað
    /ˌdezoˈlaθ/ ~ [dezˈlaː] - declining in usage across all age groups, this word now has an archaic feel, used mostly ironically or to evoke a sense of older times. Cognate to Fr. désolé it is a mediæval borrowing from Lt. dēsōlātus "forsaken".
Apresc meðes l'ai-jo pardon peðið, il fasceirn ses a mei.
Ah, m'il sorc !
Even after I said sorry, they were still angry with me.
Oh, how awful !
Spoiler:
/aˌpʁɛx meˈðɛs leˌʒo paʁˈdɔn peˌðɪθ | ɪl faˈʃiʁn̩ ˌsɛs a ˈmi ‖ ˌah | mi ˈsɔʁk/
[aˌpʁɛç meˈðɛs leˈʒo pɑɐ̯ˈdɔm peˈðɪː | i faˈʃiʁn̩ ˌsɛs a ˈmi ‖ ˈaː | mi ˈsɔɐ̯k]
Apresc meðes l'-ai-jo pardon peð-ið, il fasc-eirn ses a mei. Ah, m'-il sorc !
after-cmp even 3.obl-have.1s-1s.sbj sorry ask-ptcp.pfv | 3p.sbj anger-3p.pst 3p.rfl to 1s.dsj || oh | 1s.obl-def sadness
Last edited by Jackk on Fri 24 Aug 2018, 22:28, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Boral scratchpad - romlang

Post by Jackk » Wed 22 Aug 2018, 15:01

Zekoslav wrote:
Wed 22 Aug 2018, 14:38
It's the creative use of the typeset, as well as the laidback, story-like style where you present snippets of your language (the "Chaque mot a son histoire"-style, if you get what I mean).
Good to know! Thanks for going into a little more detail - honestly the snippet-style write-ups are more due to my own laziness than to any artistic vision. [:D] But if people enjoy them they can continue. [:)]
gestaltist wrote:
Wed 22 Aug 2018, 14:55
I like what I'm seeing, and you really have a knack for explaining things. A pleasant read. Keep it coming.
'Nia-tei ! 😊
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Re: Boral scratchpad - romlang

Post by Jackk » Thu 23 Aug 2018, 15:22

Finish polishing the furnishings! - the -ir augment

There is a class of verbs in Boral which take the augment -isc- /ix/ in the majority of their forms. This morpheme descends from Latin -esc- used to denote motion (literal or metaphorical) or causation. It appears most often in English as -ish (see title).

The poster-child for this class of verbs is of course finir /fiˈnɪʁ/, "to finish". Here we contrast its present indicatif, imparfeit indicatif and futur deis forms with those of the superficially similar verb benir "bless" (which is not in this class).
  1. Present indicatif
    • Jo finisc, tu finisc, i finisc; nos finisceu, vos finisceð, il finiscn
    • Jo beni, tu beni, i beni; nos benieu, vos benieð, il benin
      So the augment-class verb conjugates like a hypothetical infinitive finiscir, whereas the other conjugates like a hypothetical benieir. This pattern continues in the imperfect:
  2. Imparfeit indicatif
    • Jo finisce, tu finisce, i finisce; nos finiscau, vos finiscað, il finiscen
    • Jo benie, tu benie, i benie; nos beniau, vos beniað, il benien
  3. Futur deis
    • Jo finiray, tu finira, i finira; nos finireu, vos finireð, il finiraun
    • Jo beniray, tu benira, i benira; nos benireu, vos benireð, il beniraun
    Now here the two classes converge, as the "owed future" is formed from the infinitive, which does not take the augment.
Other forms which do not take the augment include: the participles fignent, finið; the perfect jo fini, nos finim; and the subjunctive jo fign, nos fignau.

Example:
Y primair vig de calcun ayent allunið foy a 1969.
The first time someone landed on the moon was in 1969.
Spoiler:
  • [fiˈnɪç | fiɲˈçaw finˈʃeθ fiˈniçn̩]
    [beˈni | beˈnjaw beˈnjeθ beˈnɪn]
  • [finˈʃe | fiɲˈço fiɲˈʃaθ finˈʃɛn]
    [beˈnje | beˈnjo beˈnjaθ beˈnjɛn]
  • [finˈʁe finˈʁa | finˈʁaw finˈʁeθ finˈʁon]
    [benˈʁe benˈʁa | benˈʁaw benˈʁeθ benˈʁon]
/ˌi pʁiˈmeʁ ˌvaj də kalˈkɪn aˌjɛnt aliˈnɪθ ˌfoj a ˌmɪl nuf ˈʦɛnt ˌsizɛnt ˈnouf/
[i pʁiˈmeɐ̯ vaj də kalˈkɪn aˌjɛnt‿aliˈnɪθ ˌfoj a ˌmɪl nuf ˈʦɛn siˈzɛnːuf]
def first time of someone have-ptcp.act land.on.the.moon-ptcp.psv be.pst at 1969
Image
Last edited by Jackk on Mon 27 Aug 2018, 15:31, edited 4 times in total.
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Jackk
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Re: Boral scratchpad - romlang

Post by Jackk » Fri 24 Aug 2018, 14:01

Plusour etymology

Let's have a look at the example sentence I gave last time:

Y primair vig de calcun allunið ayent foy a 1969.
The first time someone landed on the moon was in 1969.

  • primair - from Lt. prīmārius "first", cognate to Fr. premier, primaire. -air is the usual reflex of Lt. -arius, but we also sometimes see the form -ary, particularly when used to form nouns, as in cavalary "etiquette".
  • vig - from Lt. vices "time, instance". Cognate to Fr. fois, Sp. veces.
  • allunið - past participle of allunir "to land on the moon", an uncommon, technical or jocular verb formed by comparison with atterrir "to land", itself a compound of a "to" + ter "ground" + -ir. See also alluniscag "lunar landing", which is somewhat more common.
  • ayent - present participle of aïr "to have", descending ultimately from Lt. habentem, and cognate to Fr. ayant. Compare with ant "(along) with", from the same source but reduced through common use.
Spoiler:
  • [pʁiˈmeɐ̯] ; [kaˌvaləˈʁi]
  • [vaʝ]
  • [ˌalɨˈnɪθ] ; [aˌlinɨˈʃɛʝ]
  • [aˈjɛn(t)] ; [an(t)]
Last edited by Jackk on Fri 24 Aug 2018, 22:34, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Boral scratchpad - romlang

Post by gestaltist » Fri 24 Aug 2018, 15:36

Jackk wrote:
Fri 24 Aug 2018, 14:01
Plusour etymology
[*] allunið - past participle of allunir "to land on the moon", an uncommon, technical or jocular verb formed by comparison with atterrir "to land", itself a compound of a "to" + ter "ground" + -ir. See also alluniscag "lunar landing", which is somewhat more common.
Details like this are precisely what makes this thread stand out to me.
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Re: Boral scratchpad - romlang

Post by Jackk » Fri 24 Aug 2018, 15:48

gestaltist wrote:
Fri 24 Aug 2018, 15:36
Details like this are precisely what makes this thread stand out to me.
Thank you! 😊 It's what I'm going for - though I must admit that I stole allunir from the entirely parallel French construction alunir, however rarely that particular verb gets used [B)] .
Eresse anga paris cur neduc, a san teonga.
The only thing more dangerous than doubt is certainty.
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