False cognates

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Aszev
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Re: False cognates

Post by Aszev » Sun 10 Jun 2018, 18:02

English Ferris wheel (from the person G.W.G. Ferris)

Swe/Dan/Nor pariserhjul (from the city of Paris)
Sound change works in mysterious ways.

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All4Ɇn
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Re: False cognates

Post by All4Ɇn » Sun 10 Jun 2018, 20:04

Aszev wrote:
Sun 10 Jun 2018, 18:02
English Ferris wheel (from the person G.W.G. Ferris)

Swe/Dan/Nor pariserhjul (from the city of Paris)
Oh wow that's a really interesting one!
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Shemtov
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Re: False cognates

Post by Shemtov » Tue 19 Jun 2018, 21:24

:lat: IOVE /jowe/ "To Jupiter" :isr: The Tetragrammaton according to Genesius; both are /jVwe/ sequences.
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Shemtov
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Re: False cognates

Post by Shemtov » Wed 20 Jun 2018, 00:46

:ind: पैसा /pɛsa/"Unit of Indian currency" :esp: Peso "Unit of currency in many Hispanic countries"
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Re: False cognates

Post by k1234567890y » Thu 19 Jul 2018, 07:28

Just found this:

Chichewa ufa "flour" and Manchu ufa "flour"
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eldin raigmore
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Re: False cognates

Post by eldin raigmore » Thu 19 Jul 2018, 20:08

Shemtov wrote:
Wed 20 Jun 2018, 00:46
:ind: पैसा /pɛsa/"Unit of Indian currency" :esp: Peso "Unit of currency in many Hispanic countries"
How do we know this is a false cognate?
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Shemtov
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Re: False cognates

Post by Shemtov » Thu 19 Jul 2018, 20:21

eldin raigmore wrote:
Thu 19 Jul 2018, 20:08
Shemtov wrote:
Wed 20 Jun 2018, 00:46
:ind: पैसा /pɛsa/"Unit of Indian currency" :esp: Peso "Unit of currency in many Hispanic countries"
How do we know this is a false cognate?
The Hindi word actually comes from PIE *pods "Foot", meaning "A Foot-Length of something" that somehow became a unit of weight. Peso comes from a Latin word related to the Latin word that gave us "Pound", which both come from PIE *(s)pend "To stretch"
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Re: False cognates

Post by Imralu » Fri 20 Jul 2018, 02:08

So, generally I'd be skeptical of conlang examples without some pretty involved justification to show that there wasn't even subconscious borrowing, but it just so happens my conlang Wena (which I'm now calling Ngehu) has this:
  • :con: Ngehu: mwalimu = teacher, mentor, guru (from mwa "leader" + limu "learner", which in turn comes from li "beginner" + mu "knowing one")
  • :tan: Swahili: mwalimu (pl. walimu) = teacher (from Arabic: مُعَلِّم‎ muʿallim "teacher", which is derived from عَلَّمَ‎ ʿallama "to teach", from the root ع ل م‎ ʿ-l-m which is related to knowing and knowledge)
So, the reason it fits here is it's not even a subconscious borrowing. I came up with all the syllabic roots for Wena/Ngehu well before I started learning Swahili or ever knew the word mwalimu. The obvious word for "teach(er)" would be zyelimu, basically "one who causes/makes learners" but that sounds very much more like the compulsory education word - someone who forces learning. When I was writing it down I suddenly thought "That sounds like Swahili mwalimu!" and I realised that using mwa "leader", we get a softer sounding word, more like a facilitator of learning, mentor, guru etc., which also matches how mwalimu is used as an honorific title Swahili, especially referring to Julius Nyerere. So, indirectly, it's kind of a borrowing because I thought of using mwa because of Swahili, but without Swahili I could easily have created this word from these roots, especially if looking for an honorific kind of word for a teacher/mentor.
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