A Germanic Translation Comparison

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Salmoneus
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A Germanic Translation Comparison

Post by Salmoneus » Mon 12 Dec 2016, 21:53

Recently I've been toying with a germanic language, and I've noticed that quite a few other people seem to have one. I thought it might make sense to create a compendium of quotations of the same sentences, so that we could compare our languages more easily.

To that end, I drew up a list of 11 arbitrary lines. Reflecting the fact that these are Germanic languages, I put in four lines from Anglo-Saxon poems, starting with the opening lines of Caedmon's Hymn, the oldest substantial poem in a Germanic language known; the 11th line is from the Eddas, and slightly different in tone. In addition, there are three religious lines chosen for the fact that they're extremely widely translated: the first lines of genesis, a line from the story of the Tower of Babel, and the doxology that Protestants add on to the paternoster. There are also two absurd sentences that are widely translated, and a random sentence that I happened to find translated into several Germanic languages on wikipedia.

If anyone has any really good brief lines to add - preferably Germanic in origin and perhaps illustrating some interesting feature of vocabulary or syntax - do suggest them, but my intent here is more to have a small and simple corpus for comparison, rather than an open-ended and intimidating translation game.

If anyone can translate any or all of these lines into Germanic languages - real or constructed - please do! For real languages, let's keep it minimal: say, German, Dutch, Friesian, Gothic, an Insular North Germanic language and a Continental North Germanic languages. Let's not clog it up with too many minor dialects.

For your constructed languages: if appropriate, it might be helpful if you gave a position in the family (north, east, ingvaeonic, etc) and an approximate time period.

I'm planning just on compiling the translations without explanations, for ease of comparison. However, if you want to provide formal glosses and/or translator's notes in your posts, to serve as an appendix, please do!
Salmoneus
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Re: A Germanic Translation Comparison

Post by Salmoneus » Mon 12 Dec 2016, 21:53

1.
Thrinn: Nu munnem vir þen vård þes riks þes himns, þen maħte þes skapers äg hesa fersiħt luven.
Øyntuystung: Yn’àrrian wyll wi a’traft ða ward av ða Heevnesrinnariekja, ða mätt van ða Duylewa aj móðyðank hes.
English: Now we should praise the warden of the kingdom of heaven, the might of the creator and his purpose.
Town Speech: 今吾等しょっら゚ん褒わ゚んだ衛兵ふぉんだ天国、だ造物主之力又んさい目的。
Sadrås: Nœ müchta jous glüttramekken dene Drottenfreye yös Übercledes, þë Megghtschippe den Olrumekküns ent hem Vfame.
Koulesch: Jetz sullen wir n'bewacher vomme himmelschen kynigtuom, dj'macht vomme Schaffer und sain zil loben.
Austrian: Nū skulum vis, i lydem orčan zyngardžu himna, magt v alskapřa jag dumunin u ma.
Vorian: Ноу, на ѫзь хроутьянъ врадъ шьмьньско ричья, мощь скопарья я вытѫщь ѥ.


2.
Thrinn: Hvar ist sa égher ganer? Hvar ist sa srusser? Hvar ist sa gever büter? Hvar sind þa sitter aþat fest? Hvar sind þar ferar iner haller?
Øyntuystung: Wheð’ is ða hesti ywända? Wheði, ða riðar? Whar stáð ða máthemyàvar? Whar, ð’ysätting bi ða sumbla? Whar stáð ða säylbøðinger?
English: Where is the horse gone? Where the rider? Where the giver of treasure? Where are the seats at the feast? Where are the revels in the hall?
Town Speech: 何処だ馬いす行あんがん?何処だ乗者いす?何処だ宝之与者いす?何処だ席在んだ祝宴せぃんど?何処だ祝りんがす中んだ堂せぃんど?
Sadrås: ühiröven gê ye Chürs? ühire der Rettün? ühiröven der Creisures Gjvün? ühiröven bêo þös Eghthefghtes Stel? Ühiröven bêo þös Salles Frix.
Koulesch: Wohin is s'pferd gegangen? wo is d'raiter? wo is d'geber vomme schatze? wo sint d'sitze amme feste? wo sint s'fest in der hallen?
Austrian: Hvad gelēd ofs? Hvad gelēd ridža? Hvad gelēd giuris mogu? Hvad gelidun stolos bi mesa dagtu? Hvar ist sprēk in hedžon?
Vorian:Охва мрохъ свѫдъ? Охва содъларь? Я мѣтможєварь? Хва сѣтья о длъть сѧдъ? Хва сѣлєтоуѩза въ солѣ?



3.
Thrinn: Sa úlþ ist fljuher; sa aðel þes súls bevrisk äg vird drög samb selv mann gägner þes súls.
English: The glory is fled, the nobility of the world ages and grows sere, as now does every man throughout the world.
Town Speech: だ栄光いす逃おうわん、だ世之貴族変老ると又ん乾がと、如す毎だる人中ん毎だる部ふぉんだ世今どぅうと。
Sadrås: flîjge þe Glüttra, mitældernmekke en ðursmekke þe Uirsæalderns Heafreyniß , olswæ Olruvœr ë olruorld dirüt.
Koulesch: D'herrlichkeit is flohen, d'adel von der welt altert und trucknet, als jeder jetz tuot.
Austrian: Vulls avzlō, adal u ferfo frallis jag zers, gliko sve hvarzo manne in allin ferfo.
Vorian: Влътъ флоухъ, отолъ фрѣха ольдь я соузить сє, свѣ я олъ монъ въ фрѣшѣ.


4.
English: Yo! We of the Spear-Danes, in days of yore, heard of the glory of those clan-kings. How those princes performed courageous deeds.
Town Speech:聴く!吾等槍デーンす、在ん昔ん日がす、聞るだんだ栄光ふぉんだ族の王がす、何う彼い勇者す行たん勇敢な行だす。
Sadrås: Hore Ðe! Geihere jous Præng-Denische þë Glüttra dennen Künne-Kïningjes ë denne Ealderntege.
Ent hœ dod den Jis enjos þeße strængehortlische Geidete.
Koulesch: Hourch! wir Sper-Tenen haben an vergangnen tagen dj'herrlichkeit von den stamms-kynigen gehourt. Wie d'helde muotige taat handelt habent.
Austrian: Sē! Vis u Gēs-Danim, in frerem allim, gefunnum chrōd u jenem zynnam slagtom. Hveva trugzun jene kungos verlikos gededin!
Vorian: Хоу! Ви Зѣзодони, въ догомъ фрѣнѣмъ, хоузьдѣмъ ѫбь влътъ щѣза стомокънѧзоу. Хвоу щѣ отолѧза товьдѣ блаты връщѧ.

5.
Icelandic: Í upphafi skapaði Guð himin og jörð. Jörðin var þá auð og tóm, og myrkur grúfði yfir djúpinu.
Swedish: I begynnelsen skapade Gud himmel och jord. Och jorden var öde och tom, och mörker var över djupet.
Thrinn: Am beginning skop Guð þer himner äg þa Earðe. Äg se Earðe var formerlösse äg lere, äg se mearkiðe var aner djüpe.
English: In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. And the earth was formless and empty, and darkness was upon the face of the deep.
Frisian: Yn it begjin hat God de himel en de ierde scepen. De ierde wie leech en sûnder foarm. It tjuster lei oer de ôfgrûn.
Town Speech: 在んだ始いんにんぐ、神造ううぷだ天す又んだ地。だ地わっす形無す又ん空る、又ん闇わっす上ぷだ淵之面。
Dutch: In den beginne schiep God den hemel en de aarde. De aarde nu was woest en ledig, en duisternis was op den afgrond
Siglisc: In de begin mat God de himle an de grund. An de grund fra haudelos an ler an dunkle dek di dipe.
Sadrås: Ê þë Nemüne, makked der Frey Matere yeße Übrclede en þë Ærdte. Ent ves þe Ærdt schipfljôß ent geilære, ent übrelecgad þe Deorcheniß þë Dœpfðe.
Koulesch: Amme anfange schuoff Gott himmel und erden. Und d'erde was gelaaszlos und lær, und finsterheit was auf der fleche von der tiefe.
German: Am Anfang schuf Gott Himmel und Erde. Und die Erde war wüst und leer, und es war finster auf der Tiefe
Austrian: Bi dugann geskōp Gud himn jag erda. Jag erda vas ungedogna jag otta, jag rikv vas an anverta u dypin.
Vorian: Въ бьжьнѧждѣ, Гоудъ скоупъ шьмьнѫ я ѥртоу. Я ѥрта восъ инавръща я тоума, я рєквъ восъ на льщи ждоупьнь.


6.
Thrinn:Äg av sa Harer stag, umfür þen staðe äg þen turn, þat büften þa süner Adáms seħen.
English: And the Lord came down to see the city and the tower that the sons of Adam had built.
Town Speech: 又んだ主来ああむ下だる、うむと見えいんだ町又んだ塔、だアダム之子すはっだん建と
Siglisc: An de Here hau nidrin sy szu sin din heus an trom di son o Adam ha beugn.
Sadrås: Ent dûnkemme der Matere Frey dåc sœðen yë Krœcby ent yë Keliken ünj geigestregghte den Adams Shen.
Koulesch: Und fur d'Herre hernieder und er sah dj'burg und s'houchnis, die d'syne von Adam gebaut haaten
Austrian: Jag Froja ufkvam, an i fulk jag čelko sefi, hva gerettun dugtra v Adam
Vorian Я Дръщьнъ възия сєханъ на бръгъ я рѣзьдъ хворя съньвь Адама бывьдѣнъ.


7.
Icelandic: Menn eru gæddir vitsmunum og samvisku, og ber þeim að breyta bróðurlega hverjum við annan.
Swedish: De är utrustade med förnuft och samvete och bör handla gentemot varandra i en anda av broderskap.
English:They are endowed with reason and conscience and should act towards one another in a spirit of brotherhood.
Frisian: Hja hawwe ferstân en gewisse meikrigen en hearre har foar inoar oer yn in geast fan bruorskip te hâlden en te dragen
Town Speech: せぃいゑるだと授と以ど理性又ん良心、又んしょっら゚ん扱ら゚ん互る以どだ同胞の精神。
Dutch: Zij zijn begiftigd met verstand en geweten, en behoren zich jegens elkander in een geest van broederschap te gedragen.
Sadrås: Erin þem gegeft mit þë Fürdstrûgghte ent þë Geiwicte, ent müchta þem sjþrogan än mit andere ë þë Bfrodereschipfes
Koulesch: Sie wardent mit verstand und gewizzen begabt und sullent einander imme geiste von der bryyderlichkeit behandelen.
German: Sie sind mit Vernunft und Gewissen begabt und sollen einander im Geist der Brüderlichkeit begegnen.
Austrian: Īs anōn hug jag zugt, jag skulun, i sis ałem umiten in seulu brorliča.
Vorian: Ия скѫчьда мь хъжи я сомовьщоу, я на имъ дрибанъ сє янъ ѫтєромѣ въ зѣщѣ броутѣрѣда.

8.
Thrinn: Farverlösse gröne idar slep odt.
English:Colourless green ideas sleep furiously.
Town Speech: 無色の緑ん考す眠ああぷと怒にぐ
Siglisc: Frablos, grung tenke slap vuci.
Sadrås: Sluppa geiteræbünlyc þös litenljôß grün Geidensght.
Koulesch: Farblose gryyne gedanke slaafent zornig.
Austrian: Błilose groňe munis slepan modago.
Vorian: Инафравѣ гроунѣ тѫща слѣпѫдь тръноу.


9.
Thrinn: Min lughkussenbat ist fuld éals.
English: My hovercraft is full of eels.
Town Speech: 我いホバルクラフトいす満る゚以ど鰻す。
Sadrås: Is mej Schetylleschipf mit Eale geipfîllt.
Koulesch: Main swebenfarzeyg is mit aalen foll.
Austrian: Min luftskip ist tegt miz jalkam.
Vorian: Мино флюутобѣтъ фъльдъ яломь.


10.
Thrinn: Þat måg strök þat mävel aner haken äg küsste heja anaðer kévle.
English: The boy stroked the girl on [along] the chin and kissed her on the cheek.
Town Speech: だ坊撫いいくだ少女沿ぐだ顎又ん吻すといん上ぷだ頬がん。
Sadrås: vfendle ye Jainglin þë Joungeße duon þë Chünne ent smaicce he hers duon yë Lyre.
Koulesch: D'knabe straichelte s'mædle ums kinn und kuschte sie auf d'wangen.
Austrian: Mags strēk moju kinn jag koksa ju vanga.
Vorian: Могъ стрѣкоудѣ мовюу вьдъ чьнъ я късьдѣ ѥза вѫго.

11.
English: For the kingdom, the power and the glory are yours, now and forever.
Town Speech:ふぉるだ王国だ力又んだ栄光せぃんど爾いん、今又ん永ゐぐ。
Sadrås: Orfer erin Ðejnt der Küninjdamen, þe Megghtschipp ent þe Glüttra, nœ ent övenlyc ent olruhinne.
Koulesch: Wan s'kynigtuom, d'kraft und d'herrlichkeit sint dain jetz und in eiwigkeit.
Austrian: Zis sinn ōk zyngardi, magts jag vulls, nū jag du eva.
Vorian: Зъфърь кънѧзоричь, мощь я влътъ сѧдъ ѫзєра, ноу я ная.

12.
English:And after that Loki hid himself in Franang's waterfall in the guise of a salmon, and there the gods took him. He was bound with the bowels of his son Vali, but his son Narfi was changed to a wolf.
Town Speech: 又ん後あ彼ロ゚キ隠とさい己中んフラーナング之滝中んだ様子ふぉん一ん鮭、又んだカムイす取ああまんいん彼処。ひわるど縛うんだん与どだ腸すふぉんさい子ワ゚リ゚、然くさい子ナルフィわるど化だるど込んと一ん狼。
Sadrås: Ent åtreünj hjdad sjhjs læchselyc Der Wäddarün ë dene Frananxüdedriße, ent tjïkke den Get hjs dire. ves he ründtbindt mit þeße Bvïgelîne den Walgjes hem Shanes, bunt schipfe þem Nærvgje hem andern Shane æs tuo äne Hwarlfe.
Koulesch: Und dann Loki verdeckte sich in der gestalte von eime lachse imme wazzerfall von Franang, und daar nament d'gœtte in. Er ward gebunden mit n'dærmen von saime sune Vall, aber sain sun Narfi ward verændert in einen wolf.
Austrian: Jag sik ublonn mittan Loka in vantrum Frananga malku lagsa, jag zarr nemun na gudos. Is vard gebunnans zarmam u sinam suno Valan, ak sins suns Narfa vard in vulf zerrdribans.
Vorian: Я шѧдь то, Локи драньдѣ сє въ фръшѣ Франанга, хъльдъ свѣ лошь, я торъ ѫзьвь фѫгоунъ ѩ. И восъ бѫдонъ трамомь ѥ съноу Вали, тоухъ ѥ сънъ Нарфи вратъ врагоу.

13.
Thrinn: Mine hand ist in varme vatne.
English:My hand is in warm water.
Town Speech: 我い手いす中ん温む水
Sadrås: Is þe Handt mej ë vase Uade
Koulesch: Main hand is in warmem wazzer
Austrian: Mina hanns ist in chlevam vatin.
Vorian: Мина хѫдъ исть въ врамѣжѣ вощѣ.

14.
English:If a man wounds another man while the king is in the province he shall pay a fine for the wound in accordance with the law
Sadrås: uhenne Vœre deghte anderne venghte michdoch bêo der Küninj sjtygcht ë yë Schyre, skalr he vitbecan þë Schœce tuo yös Venghz œtr þë Lœghe.
Austrian: Slidže guma ałan guman, bjanns še zydans in křa, skal jens, i fergille mizdo vidr slitt getemma du Vittum.
Vorian: Юбѣ монъ вѫда ѫтєраноу монъ въ хвилѣ то кънѧзь исть въ ѫхрѧзѣ, на имѣ жлѣданъ фърь вѫдоу въ трєвѣ мь логоу.
Last edited by Salmoneus on Sun 08 Jan 2017, 13:02, edited 11 times in total.
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Re: A Germanic Translation Comparison

Post by k1234567890y » Tue 13 Dec 2016, 02:10

:con: Town Speech(formerly Urban Basanawa)

Classified as an Ingvaeonic language but not an Anglo-Frisian language, or classified as one of the Low German languages

Except for 5-1. and 13., every translation given below contains at least one non-Germanic word.

1.
今吾等しょっら゚ん褒わ゚んだ衛兵ふぉんだ天国、だ造物主之力又んさい目的。
/naʊ wɪ ʃɔlən lo:vən də e:he: fɔn də tɛŋgɔkʊ̥ də zo:bʊtsʊ̥ʃʊ sə maxt ʊn saɪ mɔkʊ̥tɛkɪ̥/(pronounciation)
今 吾等 しょっら゚ん 褒わ゚ん だ 衛兵 ふぉん だ 天国 だ 造物主 之 力 又ん さい 目的
now 1.PL.NOM should.PRES-PL praise-INF the guard from/of the Heaven the Creator 3.POSS might and 3.SG.POSS purpose(interlinear)

2.
何処だ馬いす行あんがん?何処だ乗者いす?何処だ宝之与者いす?何処だ席在んだ祝宴せぃんど?何処だ祝りんがす中んだ堂せぃんど?
/wɑ:ɹ də ɹɔs ɪs gaŋgən wɑ:ɹ də ɹaɪdəɹ ɪs wɑ:ɹ də ʃat sə ge:vəɹ ɪs wɑ:ɹ də sɪt.s an də ʃʊkʊ.ɛn sɪnt wɑ:ɹ də mi:ɹɪŋgəs ɪn də haɫ sɪnt/(pronounciation)
何処 だ 馬 いす 行あんがん 何処 だ 乗者 いす 何処 だ 宝 之 与者 いす 何処 だ 席す 在ん だ 祝宴 せぃんど 何処 だ 祝りんがす 中ん だ 堂 せぃんど
where the horse be.3.SG.PRES go.PST.PTCP where the rider be.3.SG.PRES where the treasure 3.POSS giver is where the seat-PL at the festival be.3.PL.PRES where the celebration in the hall be.3.PL.PRES(interlinear)

3.
だ栄光いす逃おうわん、だ世之貴族変老ると又ん乾がと、如す毎だる人中ん毎だる部ふぉんだ世今どぅうと。
/də e:kɔ ɪs flo:wən də wɛɹɫt sə kɪzɔkʊ̥ fəɹɔɫdəɹt ʊn dɹi:gət as jɛdəɹ man ɪn jɛdəɹ di:ɫ fon də wɛɹɫt naʊ du:t/(pronounciation)
だ 栄光 いす 逃おうわん だ 世 之 貴族 変老ると 又ん 乾がと 如す 毎だる 人 中ん 毎だる 部 ふぉん だ 世 今 どぅうと
the glory be.3.SG.PRES flee.PST.PRCP the world 3.POSS nobility become.old-3.SG.PRES and become.dry-3.SG.PRES as every person in every part from/of the world now do.PRES-3.SG(interlinear)

4.
聴く!吾等槍デーンす、在ん昔ん日がす、聞るだんだ栄光ふぉんだ族の王がす、何う彼い勇者す行たん勇敢な行だす。
/hɔɹk wɪ spe:ɹde:ns an fəɹgaŋgən dagəs hi:ɹdən də e:kɔ fɔn də zɔkʊnɔ kɪŋgəs haʊ di: bɔxatɛɹs li:stən ju:kanna dɑ:dəs/(pronounciation)
聴く 吾等 槍デーンす 在ん 昔ん 日がす 聞るだん だ 栄光 ふぉん だ 族の 王がす 何う 彼い 勇者す 行たん 勇敢な 行だす
hark 1.PL.NOM Spear.Dane-PL at past day-PL hear-PST-PL the glory from/of the tribe-ADJ king-PL how those hero-PL perform.PST-PL brave deed-PL(interlinear)

5-1.
在んだ始いんにんぐ、神造ううぷだ天す又んだ地。だ地わっす形無す又ん空る、又ん闇わっす上ぷだ淵之面。(Romanization: An de beginning God shoop de hevens und de erd. de erd was geshapelos und leer, und dunkelness was up de deep se fleke)
/an də bəgɪnnɪŋk gɔt ʃu:p də he:vəns ʊn də ɛɹt də ɛɹt was gəʃɑ:plɔs ʊn li:ɹ ʊn dʊŋkəɫnəs was ʊp də di:p sə fle:k/(pronounciation)
在ん だ 始いんにんぐ 神 造ううぷ だ 天 又ん だ 地 だ 地 わっす 形無す 又ん 空る 又ん 闇 わっす 上ぷ だ 淵 之 面
at the beginning God create.PST.3.SG the sky and the earth the earth be.PST.3.SG form-less and empty and darkness be.PST.3.SG upon the deep 3.POSS surface(interlinear)

5-2.
又んだ主来ああむ下だる、うむと見えいんだ町又んだ塔、だアダム之子すはっだん建と(Romanization: Und de Herre kame nedder um to sehn de burg und de widja, de Adam se sohns hadden baut)
/ʊn də hɛɹ kɑ:m nɛdəɹ ʊm tə se:n də bʊɹx ʊn də wɪdʒa də adam sə so:ns hadən baʊt/
又ん だ 主 来ああむ 下だる うむ と 見えいん だ 町 又ん だ 塔 だ アダム 之 子す はっだん 建と
and the lord come.PST.3.SG down around to see-INF the city and the tower REL Adam 3.POSS son-PL have.PST-PL build-PST.PTCP(うむと/um to = in order to)

6.
せぃいゑるだと授と以ど理性又ん良心、又んしょっら゚ん扱ら゚ん互る以どだ同胞の精神。
/si: wɛɹdət bəgɪft mɪt ɹɪse: ʊn ɹjo:ʃɪn ʊn ʃɔlən bəhandələn ɛɫk.ɔdəɹ mɪt də do:ho:nɔ se:ʃɪn/(pronounciation)
せぃい ゑるだと 授と 以ど 理性 又ん 良心 又ん しょっら゚ん 扱ら゚ん 互る 以ど 同胞の 精神
3.PL.NOM/ACC become.PRES-PL bestow.PST with reason and conscience and should.PRES-PL treat-INF each.other with the sibling-ADJ spirit(interlinear)

7.
無色の緑ん考す眠ああぷと怒にぐ。
/mʊʃɔkʊnɔ gɹi:n gədaxt.s slɑ:pt tɔɹnɪç/(pronounciation)
無色の 緑ん 考す 眠ああぷと 怒にぐ
colorless green thought-PL sleep.PRES-PL furious(interlinear)

8.
我いホバルクラフトいす満る゚以ど鰻す。(Romanization: My hovercraft is full mid aals)
/maɪ hɔvəɹkɹaft ɪs fʊɫ mɪt ɑ:ɫs/(pronounciation)
我い ホバルクラフト いす 満る゚ 以ど 鰻す
1.SG.POSS hovercraft be.3.SG.PRES full with eel-PL(interlinear)

9.
だ坊撫いいくだ少女沿ぐだ顎又ん吻すといん上ぷだ頬がん。
/də knɑ:f stɹi:k də ʃo:dʒɔ ɛntlaŋk də kɪn ʊn kɪst ɪn ʊp də wɑŋgən/(pronounciation)
だ 坊 撫いいく だ 少女 沿ぐ だ 顎 又ん 吻すと いん 上ぷ だ 頬がん
the boy stroke.PST.3.SG the girl along the chin and kiss.PST.3.SG 3.SG.PERSON.ACC upon the cheek-PL(interlinear)

10.
ふぉるだ王国だ力又んだ栄光せぃんど爾いん、今又ん永ゐぐ。
/fɔɹ də kɪŋgdəm də maxt ʊn də e:kɔ sɪnt daɪn naʊ ʊn i:wɪç/(pronounciation)
ふぉる だ 王国 だ 力 又ん だ 栄光 せぃんど 爾いん 今 又ん 永ゐぐ
because the kingdom the might the glory be.PRES.PL 2.SG.POSS now and forever(interlinear)

11.
又ん後あ彼ロ゚キ隠とさい己中んフラーナング之滝中んだ様子ふぉん一ん鮭、又んだカムイす取ああまんいん彼処。ひわるど縛うんだん与どだ腸すふぉんさい子ワ゚リ゚、然くさい子ナルフィわるど化だるど込んと一ん狼。
/ʊn nɑ: dat lɔkɪ haɪt saɪsɛɫf ɪn fɹɑ:naŋk sə wɑ:təɹfaɫ ɪn də jo:sʊ fɔn ɛn laks ʊn də kamʊɪs nɑ:mən ɪn dɑ:ɹ hɪ waɹt bʊndən mɪt də daɹms fɔn saɪ so:n valɪ ak saɪ so:n naɹfɪ waɹt fəɹɔdəɹt ɪntə ɛn wɔɫf/(pronounciation)
又ん 後あ 彼 ロ゚キ 隠と さい己 中ん フラーナング 之 滝 中ん だ 様子 ふぉん 一ん 鮭 又ん だ カムイす 取ああまん いん 彼処 ひ わるど 縛うんだん 与ど だ 腸す ふぉん さい 子 ワ゚リ゚ 然く さい 子 ナルフィ わるど 化だるど 込んと 一ん 狼
and after that Loki hide.PST.3.SG 3.SG.POSS-self in Franang 3.POSS waterfall in the look of one salmon and the deity-PL take.PST-PL 3.SG.PERSON.ACC there 3.SG.PERSON.NOM become.PST.3.SG bind.PST.PTCP with the bowel-PL from/of 3.SG.POSS son Vali but 3.SG.POSS son Narfi become.PST.3.SG change-PST.PTCP into one wolf(interlinear)

13.
我い手いす中ん温む水(Romanization: my hand is in warm water)
/maɪ hant ɪs ɪn waɹm wɑ:təɹ/
我い 手 いす 中ん 温む 水
1.SG hand be.PRES.3.SG in warm water

14.
エフ壹ン人傷エルタト別ル人時ンダ國王イス中ンダ地方、ヒシャッル゚拂エッラ゚ン壹ン法定ノ罰金為ルダ傷害(note the use of katakana and kyujitai)
/ɛf ɛn man du:t ʃo:gaɪ ɛn.ɔdəɹ man wɛn də kɔkʊ.o: ɪs ɪn də tʃɪho: hɪ ʃaɫ bətɛlən ɛn ho:te:nɔ bakkɪn fɔr də ʃo:gaɪ/
エフ 壹ン 人 傷エルタト 別ル 人 時ン ダ 國王 イス 中ン ダ 地方 ヒ シャッル゚ 拂エッラ゚ン 壹ン 法定ノ 罰金 為ル ダ 傷害
if one person harm.PRES-3.SG another person when the king be.PRES.3.SG is in the region 3.SG.PERSON.NOM shall.PRES.3.SG pay-INF a legal fine for the harm
Edit: 15th/Dec/2016: 3. has been modified, and added 13.
24th/Dec.2016: added 14.
Last edited by k1234567890y on Fri 23 Dec 2016, 17:46, edited 14 times in total.
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Rosenkohl
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Re: A Germanic Translation Comparison

Post by Rosenkohl » Wed 14 Dec 2016, 01:27

I like the lines you've picked, they seem well-suited for the undertaking. I'm looking forward to seeing other people's renditions. For the purposes of comparison, how about adding Swadesh? We could PM it to you so as to not clutter up the thread, or add it in spoilers. Just a thought.

Here are my translations for Austrian (East Germanic). Glossing all of these will take time and energy I don't have right now.
Edit: All glosses ready! (not sure who's paying attention, but hey...)
1. Nū skulum vis, i lydem orčani zyngardžu himna, magt v alskapřaii jag dumuniniii u maiv.
2. Hvadv gelēd ofsvi? Hvad gelēd ridža? Hvad gelēd giuris moguvii? Hvad gelidun stolos bi mesa dagtu? Hvar ist sprēk in hedžon?
3. Vulls avzlōviii, adal u ferfo frallis jag zers, gliko sve hvarzo manne in allin ferfo.
4. Sēix! Vis u Gēs-Danim, in frerem allimx, gefunnumxi chrōdxii u jenemxiii zynnam slagtomxiv. Hveva trugzun jene kungosxv verlikosxvi gededin!
5. Bi dugann geskōp Gud himn jag erda. Jag erda vas ungedognaxvii jag ottaxviii, jag rikv vas an anverta u dypin.
6. Jag Froja ufkvam, an i fulkxix jag čelko sefi, hva gerettun dugtraxx v Adamaxxi.
7. Īsxxii anōnxxiii hugxxiv jag zugtxxv, jag skulun, i sis ałem umiten in seulu brorliča.
8. Błilose groňe munis slepan modago.
9. Min luftskip ist tegt mizxxvi jalkam.
10. Mags strēk moju kinn jag koksa ju vangaxxvii.
11. Zisxxviii sinn ōkxxix zyngardi, magts jag vulls, nū jag du eva.
12. Jag sik ublonnxxx mittan Lokaxxxi in vantrum Frananga malkuxxxii lagsa, jag zarr nemun na gudos. Is vard gebunnans zarmam u sinam suno Valin, ak sins suns Narfa vard in vulf zerrdribans.
13. Mina hanns ist in chlevam vatin.
14. Slidže gumaxxxiii ałan guman, bjanns še zydans in křaxxxiv, skal jensxxxv, i fergillexxxvi mizdo vidr slitt getemma du Vittum.
Edit: Adding comments.
Comments:
Spoiler:
i: From Goth. aurtja, “gardener”. It was extended to denote anyone who tends to a place the way a gardener does his garden, a “minder” or “keeper”.

ii: The standard word for “creator”, i.e. one who creates, is skapřa. The prefixal al-, “all”, is added here to signify “creator of all”, i.e. God the Creator. It is only found in religious contexts, or sometimes facetiously to refer to someone who’s excessively proud of their creations.

iii: This is the closest I could come to OE modgeþanc. It literally means “designs”, “intentions”. Its composed of muns, a thought or idea, and du, “to”, which gives it a purposive, goal-oriented denotation.

iv: The pronominal possessive is formed this way for the third person, instead of using a dedicated declinable possessive adjective (such as min, zin). Note the stress, rather irregularly, for these phrases, falls on the preposition.

v: Translated as “whither”. Very poetic, not really used in the spoken language that much (not unlike Eng. “whither”). However, this is taken as the base form for WH-words with postpositions: hence hvar, “where”, but hvar + u, lit. “where of”, becomes hvadu.

vi: I opted for the usual word for “horse”, here, ofs. I could have used more poetic/historical forms, such as chruss (cognate of Eng. “horse”) and hangst.

vii: The word moga means “bounty, abundance”; by extension, also “treasure”, and then “treasury”. It is used in Zynlika Moga, lit. the “Royal Bounty”, which is the Austrian treasury department.

viii: Lacking a true perfect, this is the way Austrian can translate this. The perfective prefix here is av-, which means “off”.

ix: An old-timey interjection, meaning roughly “lo!”, but also “here it is” or “here we are”.

x: First, the standard word order would have vis (…) gefunnum in frerem allim, but I’m treating vis u Gēs-Danim as an anacoluthon. Poetry has generally freer word order, in any case. Secondly, the adverbial in frerem allim means “in earlier ages”, and sounds somewhat affected, like saying “yesteryear” in English.

xi: The verb i gefinne means to “to hear of” or “to come to learn”. It usually has a bare dative argument (would be chroda) or one introduced by the preposition bi, “about”. The bare accusative is quite archaic-sounding, and is mostly by analysis with imperfective i finne, “to find”, “to learn”.

xii: The noun chrōd means “glory” in the sense of triumph, victoriousness. I thought it a better translation that vulls, which is closer to grace, majesty, awe.

xiii: The distal demonstrative jens serves to further cement the poetic tone of this passage. It is completely absent from the spoken language in modern times, but still occasionally found in more high-brow literary and academic registers. Here, it merely serves to emphasise the distance (in time) between the speaker and his subject. A more tone-neutral translation would have the all-purpose demonstrative zem.

xiv: I struggled a bit to translate OE þeodcyninga. I thought of maybe using tyris, “leader, chieftain”, but that wouldn’t have quite had the same effect. I opted for zydans slagtu, lit. “king of the tribe”, which renders the original meaning quite well.

xv: I could have gone for erls, “nobleman” to translate OE æþelingas, but I felt like kungs, “prince” fit better in the verse.

xvi: The word for “brave” here is verlik, from Goth. wairaleik, lit. “manly”, “virile”. It has come to signify valour, courage, but the original sense of virility has not been completely lost, and I thought in this context it would be an appropriate translation.

xvii: This was a more delicate choice to make, since I’d be translating תהו ובהו, “toyhu vo-voyhu”. In the end, for the first adjective I went with ungedogan, which literally means “unsculpted”, or “unfashioned”, from i doge, “to fashion, sculpt”, cognate with Eng. ‘dough’.

xviii: For the second adjective, I chose ott, meaning “deserted”, “desolate”. It is a back-formation from Goth. auþida, meaning “desert”. I could have used lōs, lit. "empty", but not sure that would have achieved the same effect.

xix: Yes, the standard word for “city” is fulk, cognate with Eng. ‘folk’. I feel like in a Biblical text the word used might have been borgs, but I went for the more neutral one.

xx: The word dugtr is limited to these types of phrases, “the sons of Abraham”, “the sons of Aaron”, etc. They don’t make reference to a man’s direct offspring, but to all his descendants as a whole. It is from PGmc *deuhtrą, and the root here is related to that of ‘daughter’.

xxi: In newer translations of the Bible, some names are changed to better resemble their ‘original’ form. Regular sound changes would have had the dative singular of Adam as Amma, not Adama, as it is here. This sort of declension is still present in some common given names, but Adam is not one of them.

xxii: In spoken language, the 3PL pronoun would be used instead, as it refers to "all humans"; īs is strongly associated with the masculine sex, and is mostly used to refer to groups consisting only of men. In the written language, the nominative form īs is still preferred in all cases, but that has been changing.

xxiii: The verb i anovi is used here instead of a passive construction. Very broadly, it means “to possess [as an attribute]”, and can be variously translated with ‘boast’, ‘have’, or, as it would be here, ‘be endowed with’.

xxiv: Hugs is used here for Eng. ‘reason’. It is a word that most aptly translates as “capacity or faculty of rational thought”, but it is also sometimes used when English would have ‘mind’.

xxv: Zugts can mean both “consciousness” or “conscience”, i.e. both a more abstract sense of “self-awareness” and a moral one, as “moral compass” or “righteousness”.

xxvi: The construction tegts miz literally translates as “thick with”. The obvious choice to an English speaker would be fulls plus a bare dative, but that would be incorrect. The latter implies that something is full to capacity with whatever it ought to be filled with, i.e. a glass of water can be fulls vatin, but not tegts miz vatin.

xxvii: Austrian aspectual distinctions work much more similarly to Slavic languages than English. I made the choice to read the first verb as durative and the second one as punctual, so I used their imperfective and perfective forms, respectively. The perfective of strēk would be ustrēk, and the imperfective of koksa would be bekoksa. The latter verb is rare in that its unmarked form is the one with the perfective reading, and it gains an affix to mark its imperfectivity.

xxviii: This use of zis really marks the extent to which the bare dative can convey possession. (You may have noticed that both bare datives and u + dative are used to translated English possessives.)

xxix: The placement of the conjunction ōk, “because”, after the verb is typical of very formal writing, but also found in religious texts due to its prevalence in biblical Austrian.

xxx: The verb i sik ublinne means “to blend in”, “to camouflage”; given Loki’s method for hiding in this passage, this seemed like a better alternative than the standard verb for hiding, i sik gelagňe.

xxxi: I have opted for using the weak masculine endings in -a native to Austrian instead of the Nordic -i. This was the practice in the 19th and early 20th centuries, but nowadays would be considered in poor taste, and the forms with -i would be preferred (and declined as neutral ja-stems).

xxxii: Malka is the word for ‘guise’. Here it means “likeness”, “appearance”, but its primary meaning is “portrait”. It comes from Gothic manaleika, “image of a man”, and the medial cluster from MiA manlka was resolved as malka, instead of the regular *manka probably due to influence of German malen.

xxxiii: I opted for guma, which literally denotes a male human, as opposed to manna. I'm not well-versed in ancient and mediaeval legal documents, so I am not certain to which extent the distinction would matter.

xxxiv: The word krē, here in the (irregular) dative singular křa, comes from Slavic kraj, and means “region”, “territory”. It is also the official way of referring to the Kingdom of Austria’s different regions.

xxxv: Here the distal demonstrative jens is used in a purely intratextual way, as it often is in academic and legal writing, namely to differentiate between two entities in a previous clause. Jens clearly makes reference to the first guma, the one that caused the wound, as opposed to the second one, whereas is, the usual 3SG masculine nominative personal pronoun, would have been ambiguous (well, context here makes it very clear, but in legal documents its usage is highly recommended regardless).

xxxvi: The "proper" word order here would be i mizdo vidr slitt fergille, but it is not altogether uncommon for the verb to come in first position after the complementiser if there are no short or simple candidates to precede it (one or two words, usually).
Glosses:
Spoiler:

Code: Select all

 1. nū  skul-u-m      vis     i lyd-e-m         ort-jan       zyngard-ju     himn-a        magt-∅       u  alskapr-ja     dumun-in      u  ma
    now shall-IND-1PL 1PL.NOM C praise-SBJV-1PL warden-ACC.SG kingdom-DAT.SG heaven-DAT.SG power-ACC.SG of creator-DAT.SG design-ACC.PL of 3SG.DAT
   [ˈnyː ˈskyːlʏɱvɪ.z‿ɪˈlyːðɛˈm‿ɔɾʃan ˈzʏɲaɾʃʏ ˈhɪmna ˈmɔt valˈskapʃa ðʏ̆ˈmyːnɪˌn‿ʏma]

2. hvad    ge-lēd-∅-∅         of-s?
   whither PFV-go.PST-IND-3SG horse-NOM.SG
   [ˈfað ˈʁleːˈð‿ʊfs]

   hvad    gelēd-∅-∅          rid-ja?
   whither PFV-go.PST-IND-3SG rider-NOM.SG
   [ˈfað ˈʁleːð ˈriːʒa]

   hvad    gelēd-∅-∅          giur-is      mog-u?
   whither PFV-go.PST-IND-3SG giver-NOM.SG bounty-DAT.SG
   [ˈfað ˈʁleːð ˈʒyːɾɪz ˈmuːʒʏ]

   hvad    gelid-u-n          stōl-os     bi mēs-a        dagt-u?
   whither PFV-go.PST-IND-3PL seat-NOM.PL at table-DAT.SG feast-DAT.SG
   [ˈfað ˈʁliːðʏn ˈsɔɪ̯lʊz ˈvmeːza ˈðɔtʏ]

   hvar  ist            sprēk-∅      in hed-jon?
   where be.PRS.IND.3SG mirth-NOM.SG in hall-DAT.SG
   [ˈfaɾ‿ɪs ˈspɾeɛ̯k‿ɪnˈheːʒʊn]

3. vull-s       av-zlō-∅-∅,
   glory-NOM.SG PFV-flee.PST-IND-3SG
   [ˈvʏlz‿ɔˈzluː]

   adal-∅          u  ferf-o       frall-j-∅-s     jag zers-∅-∅-s,
   nobility-NOM.SG of world-DAT.SG age-PRS-IND-3SG and dry-PRS-IND-3SG
   [ˈɔːðal‿ʏˈfɛɾfu ˈfɾalɪz jɔˈzɛɾs]

   glīk-o      sve hvar<z>o           mann-e        in all-in           ferf-o.
   similar-ADV as  every<NOM.SG.MASC> person-GEN.PL in whole-DAT.SG.DEF world-DAT.SG
   [ˈʁliːkʊ sfɛˈfaɾzʊ ˈmanɛ jɪˈnalɪn ˈfɛɾfʊ]


4. sē! vis     u  gēs-dan-im,       in frer-em                all-im,
   lo  1PL.NOM of spear-dane-DAT.PL in early-DAT.FEM.PL.INDEF era-DAT.PL
   [ˈseː vɪzʏˌʒeːzˈðɔːnɪm ɪɱˈfɾeːɾɛˈm‿alɪm]

   ge-funn-u-m             chrōd-∅        u  jen-em           zydan-am    slagtom.
   PFV-hear_of.PST-IND-1PL triumph-ACC.SG of DIST-DAT.MASC.PL king-DAT.PL tribe-DAT.PL
   [ˈʁ̥fʏnʏm ˈʁɾɔɪ̯.ð‿ʏˈjeːnɛm ˈzʏnam ˈslɔtʊm]

   hveva trugg-z-u-n         jen-e            kung-os       verlik-os              geded-in!
   how   realise-PST-IND-3PL DIST-NOM.MASC.PL prince-NOM.PL brave-ACC.FEM.PL.INDEF deed-ACC.PL
   [ˈfeːva ˈtɾʊgzʏn ˈjeːnɛ ˈkʏɲʊz ˈvɛɾlɪ̆kʊz ˈʁðeːðɪn]


5. bi dugann-∅         ge-skōp-∅-∅            gud-∅     himn-∅        jag erd-a.
   by beginning-ACC.SG PFV-create.PST-IND-3SG god-NOM.PL heaven-ACC.PL and earth-ACC.PL
   [vðʏˈʁan ˈʁ̥skɔɪ̯b ˈʒʏθ ˈhɪm jɔˈwɛɾta]

   jag erd-a vas-∅-∅        un-ge-dog-an-a                             jag ott-a,
   and earth be.PST-IND-3SG NEG-PFV-fashion.PTCP-PTCP-NOM.FEM.SG.INDEF and deserted-NOM.FEM.SG.INDEF
   [jɔˈwɛɾta ˌvazʏnˈʁðʊna jɔˈwɔta]

   jag rikv-∅          vas-∅-∅       an anvert-a    u  dyp-in.
   and darkness-NOM.SG be.PST-IND-3SG on face-DAT.SG of deep-DAT.SG.NEUT.DEF
   [jɔˈrɪkf fazanaɱˈvɛɾta jʏˈðyːpɪn]

6. jag froj-a      uf-kvam-∅-∅,          an   i fulk-∅      jag čelk-o        sef-i-∅,
   and lord-NOM.SG down.PFV-come-IND.3SG PURP C city-ACC.SG  and tower-ACC.SG  see.PST-SBJV-3SG
   [jɔˈfɾɔɪ̯ja jʏfˈkfa.m‿aniˈfʊlk jɔˈʃɛlkʊ ˈseːfɪ]

   hva             ge-red-t—u-n          dugtr-a           v  Adam-a.
   REL.ACC.NEUT.PL PFV-build-PST-IND-3PL descendant-NOM.PL of Adam-DAT.SG
   [faˈʁɾɛtʏn ˈðʊtɾa vaˈdɔːma]

7. īs           anō-u-n                hug-∅         jag zugt-∅,           jag skul-u-n,
   3PL.NOM.MASC be.endowed.PRS-IND-3PL reason-ACC.SG and conscience-ACC.SG shall.PRS-IND.3PL
   [iˑzaˈnuːn ˈhʊʁ jɔˈzʊt jɔˈskyːlʏ.n‿]

   i sis      al-jem                  umit-e-n            in seul-u        brorlik-ja.
   C REFL.DAT other-DAT.MASC.PL.INDEF behave.PRS-SBJV-3PL in spirit-DAT.SG brotherhood-DAT.SG
   [ɪsɪˈzaːʒɛ.m‿ʏˈmiːtɛ.n‿ɪnˈsɛɪ̯lʏ ˈvɾʊɾlɪ̆ʃa]

8. błilos-e               gron-je           mun-is      slep-a-n          modag-o.
   colourless-NOM.MASC.PL green-NOM.MASC.PL idea-NOM.PL sleep.PRS-IND-3PL furious-ADV
   [ˈvʒiːlɔ̆zɛ ˈʁɾɔɪ̯ɲɛ ˈmʏnɪs ˈsleːpan ˈmɔɪ̯ðɔ̆ʁʊ]

9. min-∅          luftskip-∅       ist             tegt                   miz   jalkam.
   my-NOM.NEUT.SG hovercraft-NOM.SG be.PRS.IND.3SG thick-NOM.NEUT.SG.INDEF with eel-DAT.PL
   [mɪnˌlʏftˈskɪpɪs ˈtɛʃt mɪzˈjalkam]

10. mag-s      strēk-∅-∅          mō-ju       kinn-∅     jag kok-s-a-∅        ju          vang-a.
    boy-NOM.SG stroke.PST-IND-3SG girl-DAT.SG chin-ACC.SG and kiss-PST-IND-3SG 3SG.FEM.DAT cheek-ACC.SG
    [ˈmɔs ˈsɾeɛ̯k ˈmɔɪ̯jʏ ˈkɪn jɔˈkʊksajʏ ˈvaɲa]

11. zis     sinn           ōk      zyngard-i,     magt-s       jag vull-s,      nū  jag du ev-a.
    2SG.DAT be.PRS.IND.3PL because kingdom-NOM.SG might-NOM.SG and glory-NOM.SG now and to eternity-DAT.SG
    [ˈzɪsːɪˈn‿oːg ˈzʏɲaɾtɪ ˈmɔts jɔˈvʏls | ˈnyː jɔdʏˈjeːva]

12. jag sik      u-blonn-∅-∅           mittan Lok-a       in vantr-um         Franang-a      malk-u       lags-a,
    and REFL.ACC PFV-blend.PST-IND-3SG then   Loki-NOM.SG in waterfall-DAT.PL Franang-DAT.SG image-DAT.SG salmon-DAT.SG
    [jɔskʏˈvlʊn mɪˈtan ˈlɔɪ̯ka ɪɱˈvantɾʏm ˈfɾanaɲa ˈmalkʏ ˈlɔsa]

    jag zarr  nem-u-n          na           gud-os.    is           vard-∅-∅           ge-bunn-an-s  
    and there take.PST-IND-3PL 3SG.MASC.ACC god-NOM.PL 3SG.MASC.NOM become.PST-IND-3SG PFV-bind.PTCP-PTCP-NOM.MASC.SG
    [jɔˈzaɾ ˈneːmʏna ˈʒyːðʊs | ˈzvaɾd ˈʁvʏnanz]

    zarm-am      u  sin-am                sun-o      Val-in,     ak  sin-s                 sun-s      Narf-a 
    bowel-DAT.PL of REFL.POSS-DAT.MASC.SG son-DAT.SG Vali-DAT.SG but REFL.POSS-NOM.MASC.SG son-NOM.SG Narfi-NOM.SG
    [ˈzaɾma.m‿ʏˌsiˑnamˈsyːnʊ ˈvɔːlɪn aksɪnˈsʏnz ˈnaɾfa]

    vard-∅-∅          in vulf-∅      zerrdrib-an-s.
    become.PST-IND-3SG in wolf-ACC.SG transform.PTCP-PTCP-NOM.MASC.SG
    [ˈvaɾ.t‿ɪɱˈvʏlv ˈʒðɾiːvans]


13. min-a         hann-s      ist             in chlev-am               vat-in.
    my-NOM.FEM.SG hand-NOM.SG be.PRES.IND.3SG in warm-DAT.NEUT.SG.INDEF water-DAT.SG
    [ˌmiˑnamˈhan.z‿ɪ.s‿ɪnˈʁleːvam ˈvɔːtɪn]


14. slid-j-e-∅         gum-a      al-jan                  gum-an,    bjanns še-∅             zydan-s     in kr-ja,
    hurt-PRES-SBJV-3SG man-NOM.SG other-ACC.MASC.SG.INDEF man-ACC.SG while  be.PRES.SBJV-3SG king-NOM.SG in region-DAT.SG
    [ˈsliːʒɛ ˈʒyːma ˈwaːʒan ˈʒyːman vjanʃɛˈzyːðan.z‿ɪŋˈkʃaˑ]

    skal-∅-∅         jen-s,           i fer-gill-e-∅         mizd-o      vidr    slitt-∅       getemma      du Vitt-um.
    must.PRS-IND.3SG DIST-NOM.MASC.SG C PFV-pay.PRS-SBJV-3SG fine-ACC.SG against injury-ACC.SG appropriately to law-DAT.PL
    [ˈskaljɛn.z‿ɪˈvɾʒɪlɛ ˈmɪzʊ vɪθˈslɪt ˈʁ̥tɛma dʏ̆ˈvɪtʏm]
Last edited by Rosenkohl on Sat 24 Dec 2016, 12:35, edited 11 times in total.
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Re: A Germanic Translation Comparison

Post by k1234567890y » Wed 14 Dec 2016, 03:56

:con: Koulesch

Classified as a High German dialect, probably between Central German and Upper German, mutually intelligible with Standard German.

1.
Jetz sullen wir n'bewacher vomme himmelschen kynigtuome, dj'macht vomme Schaffer und sain zil loben.
/jɛt͡s sʊllən ʋɪr nvvaxər fɔmmə hɪmməlʃən ki:nɪktu:mə dʒmaxt fɔmmə ʃaffər ʊnt saɪn t͡si:l lo:bən/(pronounciation)

2.
Wohin is s'pferd gegangen? wo is d'raiter? wo is d'geber vomme schatze? wo sint d'sitze amme feste? wo sint d'feste in der hallen?
/ʋo:jɪn ɪʃ sfɛrt ggaŋgən ʋo: ɪʃ dɾaɪtər ʋo: ɪʃ dge:bər fɔmmə ʃatt͡sə vo: sɪnt t.sɪtt͡sə ammə fɛʃtə vo: sɪnt tfɛʃtə ɪn dɛr hallən/(pronounciation)

3.
D'herrlichkeit is flohen, d'adel von der welte altert und trucknet, als jeder in der ganzen welte jetz tuot.
/tʰɛrlɪxke:t ɪʃ flo:wən d‿ɑ:dəl fɔn dɛr ʋɛltə altərt ʊnt tɾʊknət als je:dər ɪn dɛr gant͡sən ʋɛltə jet͡s tu:t/(pronounciation)

4.
Hourch! wir Sper-Tenen haben an vergangnen tagen dj'herrlichkeit von den stamms-kynigen gehourt. Wie d'helde muotige taate handelt habent.
/ho:rx ʋɪr ʃpe:rte:nən hɑ:bən an fərgaŋgnən tɑ:gən tʃʰɛrlɪxke:t fɔn dɛn ʃtamski:nɪgən kʰo:rt ʋi: tʰɛldə mu:tɪgə tɑ:tə handəlt hɑ:bənt/

5-1.
Amme anfange schuoff Gott himmel und erden. Und d'erde was gelaaszlos und lær, und finsterheit was auf der fleche von der tiefe.
/ammə anfɑŋgə ʃu:f gɔt hɪmməl ʊnt ɛrdən ʊnt d‿ɛrdə ʋas glɑ:slo:s ʊnt lɛ:r ʊnt fɪnʃtərhe:t ʋas aʊf dɛr flɛxə fɔn dɛr ti:fə/

5-2.
Und fur d'Herre hernieder und er sah dj'burg und s'houchnis, die d'syne von Adam gebaut haaten
/ʊnt fu:r tʰɛrrə hɛrni:dər ʊnt ɛr sɑ: dʒbʊrk ʊnt sho:xnɪs di: t.si:nə fɔn ɑ:dam ɡ͡baʊt hɑ:tən/

6.
Sie wardent mit verstande und gewizzen begabt und sullent einander imme geiste von der bryyderlichkeite behandelen.
/si: ʋardənt mɪt fərʃtandə ʊnt ɡ͡bɪssən bgɑ:pt ʊnt sʊllənt e:nandər immə ge:ʃtə fɔn dɛr bɾi:dərlɪxke:tə pʰandlən/

7.
Farblose gryyne gedanke slaafent zornig.
/farblo:sə gɾi:nə gdaŋkə ʃlɑ:fənt t͡sɔrnɪk/

8.
Main swebenfarzeyg is mit aalen foll.
/maɪn ʃʋe:bənfɑ:rt͡sɛɪk ɪʃ mɪt ɑ:lən fɔl/

9.
D'knabe straichelte s'mædle ums kin und kuschte sie auf d'wangen.
/tknɑ:bə ʃtraɪxəltə smɛ:dəl ʊms kɪn ʊnt kʊʃtə si: aʊf dʋaŋgən/

10.
Wan s'kynigtuom, d'kraft und d'herrlichkeit sint dain jetz und in eiwigkeite.
/ʋan ski:nɪktu:m tkɾaft ʊnt tʰɛrlɪxke:t sɪnt daɪn ɪn jɛt͡s ʊnt e:ʋɪkke:tə/

11.
Und dann Loki verdeckte sich in der gestalte von eime lachse imme wazzerfalle von Franang, und daar nament d'gœtte in. Er ward mit n'dærmen von saime sune Vall gebunden, aber sain sun Narfi ward in einen wolf verændert.
/ʊnt dan lo:kɪ fərdɛktə sɪx ɪn dɛr kʃtaltə fɔn e:mə laxsə ɪmmə ʋassərfallə fɔn fɾɑ:nɑŋ ʊnt dɑ:r nɑ:mɛnt dgɛttə ɪn ɛr ʋart mɪt ndɛrmən fɔn saɪmə su:nə fal gbʊndən ɑ:bər saɪn su:n narfɪ ʋard ɪn e:nən ʋɔlf fəɹɛndərt/

13.
main hand is in warmem wazzer
/maɪn hant ɪʃ ɪn ʋarməm ʋassər/

Note: the texts I have given might have errors, and I might edit them in the future.

Suggestion: we can also translate the sentence "my hand is in warm water", which is the same in English and in Afrikaans when written
Edit: 15th/Dec/2016: texts have been modified, added 13.
Last edited by k1234567890y on Thu 15 Dec 2016, 07:24, edited 10 times in total.
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Re: A Germanic Translation Comparison

Post by Omzinesý » Wed 14 Dec 2016, 14:20

Interesting.
I'll translate some of the easiest into Siglisc.

5. In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.
In de begin mat God de himle an de grund.

And the earth was formless and empty, and darkness was upon the face of the deep.
An de grund fra haudelos an ler an dunkle dek di dipe.

5. And the Lord came down to see the city and the tower that the sons of Adam had built.
An d-e Here hau nidr-i-n sy szu si-n d-i-n heus an trom d-i son o Adam ha beug-n.
And DEF-SG lord have.PRS down-V-INF REFL to see-INF DEF-PL-RELATIVIZED town and tower DEF-PL son of adam have.PST build-INF

7. Colourless green ideas sleep furiously.
Frablos, grung tenke slap vuci.
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Re: A Germanic Translation Comparison

Post by All4Ɇn » Thu 15 Dec 2016, 06:19

Planning on going back and updating this post with more but here are a few for now in Thrinn which is a modern day Germanic language that's considered to be in it's on branch of the Germanic family

1. Nu munnem vir þen vård þes riks þes himns, þen maħte þes skapers äg hesa fersiħt luven.
2. Hvare ist sa égher ganer? Hvar ist sa srusser? Hvar ist sa gever büter? Hvar sind þa sitter aþat fest? Hvar sind þar ferar iner haller?
3. Sa úlþ ist fljuher; sa aðel þes súls bevrisk äg vird drög samb selv mann gägner þes súls.
5. Am beginning skop Guð þer himner äg þa Earðe. Äg se Earðe var formerlösse äg lere, äg se mearkiðe var aner djüpe.
6. Äg av sa Harer stag, umfür þen staðe äg þen turn, þat büften þa süner Adáms seħen.
8. Farverlösse gröne idar slep odt.
9. Min lughkussenbat ist fuld éals.
10. Þat måg strök þat mävel aner haken äg küsste heja anaðer kévle.
13. Mine hand ist in varme vatne.
Last edited by All4Ɇn on Sat 17 Dec 2016, 20:09, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: A Germanic Translation Comparison

Post by Salmoneus » Thu 15 Dec 2016, 21:46

So, just to be clear, I've renumbered the lines, because previously I couldn't count to 6 without making a mistake, and I've added two more - one is the very brief line k12 suggested, with some good core vocabulary, and the second is a rather dry except from the Codex Runicus. Having something legal seemed appropriate, given that many of the earliest documents in Germanic languages are lawcodes.
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Re: A Germanic Translation Comparison

Post by k1234567890y » Fri 16 Dec 2016, 04:17

another suggestion:

head, shoulders, knees and toes, knees and toes
head, shoulders, knees and toes, knees and toes
and eyes and ears and mouth and nose
head, shoulders, knees and toes, knees and toes
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Re: A Germanic Translation Comparison

Post by Lambuzhao » Fri 16 Dec 2016, 23:49

[+1] Sal

[<3] [<3] [<3] [<3] This thread.
:mrgreen:

In about a week or so, I should have some contributions up and going.
[:D]
Friesian, Gothic,...
Aye aye!

[tick] :nl-fr: [tick] :got:
I'll see what I can come up with. Also :us-pa: :deu: and Old :eng: .
[:)]
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Re: A Germanic Translation Comparison

Post by Salmoneus » Sat 17 Dec 2016, 00:21

Lambuzhao: glad you like the idea.


Myself, I've finally produced sentence of my own in.... not sure. Let's call it Øyntuystung for now. I thought I'd give a little bit of insight into the word choice while I was at it. So:


Yn’àrrian wyll wi a’traft ða ward av ða Heevnesrinnariekja, ða mätt van ða Duylewa aj móðyðank hes.
praise-INF should we now the warden of the heaven.GEN.king.LNK.realm.DAT, the might of the creator-DAT and soul.thought his
/ənˈariən wyl wiː əˈtræft ðə wɑrd əv ðə ˌheːvnəsˈrɪnəˌrɪəɕa, ðə met vən ðə dujləwə aj ˈmɔːðəˌðank hes/
Now we should praise the warden of the kingdom of heaven, the might of the creator and his purpose.

yn’àrrian: to praise or to honour, derived from the noun áir, ‘honour’.

wyll: modal verb, ‘to ought to’; also a main verb, ‘to lack, require’.

a’traft: at this time; distinct from nu, which has a consequential or processive sense.

ward: warden, ruler, protector; describes the traditional role of fathers and kings.

Heevnesrinnariekj: kingdom of heaven. Older translations might have simply Hevnesriekj, but as the meaning of riekj has grown, this would now risk sounding silly, much like ‘Heavenland’. A riekj is now any realm or domain, including metaphorical ones, while a rinnariekj, literally king-realm, is more specifically a kingdom. The noun appears in the dative, the case governed by possessive av.

mätt: might, power, craft

van: of. The preposition av is more common, particularly with plainly possessive meanings; van is reserved for more conceptual connexions, and the possession of abstract qualities. Thus ða nätt av ða rinna, “the king’s net”, but ða mätt van ða rinna, “the king’s power”.

Duylewa: the irregular dative form of Duyla, “creator of the world”. Almost always found in reference to God, outside of intentionally blasphemous, obscene expressions. Found more widely, however, in the adjectival form duylech, “creative, prolific, covered in leaves or vegetation”, and the related noun duyl, “book of laws or proverbs, or such laws or proverbs taken as a mass”.

móðyðank: compound of móð, “mind, spirit, heart”, and yðank, “thought”. Móð refers to the mental, emotional and purposive faculties as a whole, particularly in the context of desires and objectives, and is distinguished from purely cognitive ur’stáðing, intelekt and yðätt, and from the muy, the faculty of recollection and the theatre in which mental acts occur. The term yðank refers to an individual’s thought as a mass or totality, rather than to individual acts of thinking (yðácht). Hence Lockes yðácht, “the thought that Locke had”, distinguished from Lockes yðank, “Locke’s body of thought” or “the general themes of Locke’s thinking”. The compound móðyðank, therefore, refers to the general thinking of the individual’s heart, soul, and emotions, as well as of their intellect, and can loosely be translated “purpose”, “motivation”, or "intention".

hes: his. Unlike almost all other modifiers, possessive pronouns follow the noun.
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Re: A Germanic Translation Comparison

Post by Salmoneus » Sat 17 Dec 2016, 19:12

Another:

Wheð’ is ða hesti ywända? Wheði, ða riðar? Whar stáð ða máthemyàvar? Whar, ð’ysätting bi ða sumbla? Whar stáð ða säylbøðinger?
Whither is the horse gone? Whither the rider? Where stand the treasure.giver? Where the seats at the feast? Where stand the hall.party.PL?
/xʂ͡ɸʷeð əz ðə ˈhestiː əˈwendən/ / ˈxʂ͡ɸʷeðiː ðə ˈriːðar/ /xʂ͡ɸʷær staːð ðə ˈmaːthəmˌjavar/ / xʂ͡ɸʷær ðəˈsetəŋ biː ðə ˈsumlə/ / xʂ͡ɸʷær staːð ðə ˌsejlˈbøðəŋgər/
Whither has the horse gone? Whither the rider? Where is the giver of treasure? Where are the seats at the feast? Where are the houseparties?

hesti: a loanword; the native word, march, may be used poetically for a stallion, or for horses in the plural, but is now primarily a word for a form of sea-kelpie, a mythological horse-monster that rises from the sea at night to seduce women. The word also occurs in some compounds, such as marchnail, “hoof, callus”.

ywända: past participle of wänden, “to go”. The word is used for movement and departure generally, and also for change and transformation. It is a neutral word, distinct from such words as farn, “to go, to spend time away” (whar is hi yfara? – “where has he ended up?”; wheð’ is hi yfara? – “where is he taking a trip to?”), rásen, “to travel to, to journey” (wheð’ is hi yrása? – “where is he journeying to?”; whar is hi yrása? – “where is he travelling around/through?”), yangen, “to go by foot, to tred, to plod”, and intransitive yą́n, “to depart”).

stáð: the verb stáðen is used not only for physical standing, but also as a verb for location: whar is hi seta? (“where is he sitting?”) and whar is hi stǫða? (“where is he standing?”) but whar stáð hi? (“where is he?”).

máthemyàvar: a compound from máthem, “treasure” and yàvar, “giver”, from yàven, “to give”. The concept of máthem is much more important in the culture than the English word suggests; by itself, it may also be translated “time of flourishing” (as when one speaks of an liff bi vøl máthem, literally “a life of much treasure” but more generally a life filled with good times) or as “reward”; it is also found in such compounds as móðmáthem, “wisdom” (literally “spirit-treasure”) and muymáthem, “good memories” (literally “memory-treasure”).

sumbla: dative form of sumbel, “party” or “feast”, referring to a semi-formal social gathering, usually of a large number, at which drink is shared. The term has also come to be used to indicate a clique, faction, or circle of intellectuals.

säylbøðinger: plural of säylbøðing, “party”, a compound of säyl, “hall” and bøðing, “event”. The säl is a large room for social entertaining, although for most people today it also serves as a living room; a bøðing is literally an event to which an invitation is required (related to bøðen, “to invite” and bøð, “an invitation”), although today the term is used more widely. A säylbøðing is typically more formal than a sumbel: anything with formal invitations or a dress code will never be a sumbel, although the reverse is not always true. A säylbøðing may be anything from a party in a campus dorm room to a formal reception (though it will typically not be a formal dinner), but there is less expectation that all attendees will know each other closely than at a sumbel, and the sumbel is associated with certain rituals and principles – such as the passing around of mead and a convention of confidentiality – that are absent from the säylbøðing.
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Re: A Germanic Translation Comparison

Post by Void » Mon 19 Dec 2016, 18:08

Vorian (Врашьска) is a South Germanic conlang. It was spoken from about the 8th to the 15th centuries in Carpathia (I guess).

1

Ноу, на ѫзь хроутьянъ врадъ шьмьньско ричья, мощь скопарья я вытѫщь ѥ.
[nu naˈõzĭ ˈxrutĭjanŭ ˈvradŭ ʃĭmĭnʲĭˈsko ˈrʲit͡ʃĭja ˈmoʃtĭ ˈskoparʲĭja ja vɯˈtõʃtĭ je]
now on 1PL-DAT worship-INF guard-ACC heavenly-GEN kingdom-GEN might-ACC creator-GEN and purpose-ACC 3SG-MASC.GEN
Now we should praise the warden of the kingdom of heaven, the might of the creator and his purpose.

2

Охва мрохъ свѫдъ? Охва содъларь? Я мѣтможєварь? Хва сѣтья о длъть сѧдъ? Хва сѣлєтоуѩза въ солѣ?
[ˈoxʋa ˈmroxŭ ˈsʋõdŭ ˈoxʋa ˈsodŭlarʲĭ ja ˈmætmoˌʒevarʲĭ xʋa ˈsætĭja odlŭˈti ˈsẽdŭ xʋa ˈsælʲeˌtujẽza vŭˈsolʲæ]
whither horse disappear-3SG.PST? whither rider? and treasure.giver? where seat-PL at feast-DAT? where happy.making-PL in hall-DAT?
Where is the horse gone? Where the rider? Where the giver of treasure? Where are the seats at the feast? Where are the revels in the hall?

3

Влътъ флоухъ, отолъ фрѣха ольдь я соузить сє, свѣ я олъ монъ въ фрѣшѣ.
[ˈvlŭtŭ ˈfluxŭ ˈotolŭ ˈfrʲæxa ˈolʲĭdĭ ja ˈsuzitĭse sʋæ ja ˈolŭ ˈmonŭ vŭˈfrʲæʃæ]
glory flee-3SG.PST nobility world-GEN olden-3SG.PRS and wither-3SG.PRS REFL like and all man in world-DAT
The glory is fled, the nobility of the world ages and grows sere, as now does every man throughout the world.

4

Хоу! Ви Зѣзодони, въ догомъ фрѣнѣмъ, хоузьдѣмъ ѫбь влътъ щѣза стомокънѧзоу. Хвоу щѣ отолѧза товьдѣ блаты връщѧ.
[xu vi ˈzæzoˌdonʲi vŭ ˈdogomŭ ˈfrʲænʲæmŭ ˈxuzĭdæmŭ ˈõbĭ ˈvlŭtŭ ˈʃtæza ˈstomoˌkŭnʲẽzu xʋu ʃtæ ˈotolẽza ˈtovĭdæ ˈblaty vrŭˈʃtẽ]
hear-2SG.IMP(interjection) 1PL day-PL.DAT old-PL.DAT hear-1PL.PST about glory-ACC DIST-PL.GEN tribe-king.PL-GEN how DIST-PL prince-PL do-3PL.PST bold-PL.ACC deed.PL-ACC
Yo! We of the Spear-Danes, in days of yore, heard of the glory of those clan-kings. How those princes performed courageous deeds.

5

Въ бьжьнѧждѣ, Гоудъ скоупъ шьмьнѫ я ѥртоу. Я ѥрта восъ инавръща я тоума, я рєквъ восъ на льщи ждоупьнь.
[vŭbĭˈʒĭnʲẽʒdæ ˈgudŭ ˈskupŭ ʃĭmĭˈnõ ja ˈjertu ja ˈjerta ˈvosŭ jinaˈvrŭʃta ja ˈtuma ja ˈrʲekʋŭ ˈvosŭ nalʲĭˈʃti ˈʒdupĭnʲĭ]
in beginning-DAT god create-3SG.PST sky-PL.ACC and earth-ACC and earth be-3SG.PST without.form-FEM and empty-FEM and darkness be-3SG.PST on face-DAT deep-DEF.SG-DAT
In the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth. And the earth was formless and empty, and darkness was upon the face of the deep.

6

Я Дръщьнъ възия сєханъ на бръгъ я рѣзьдъ хворя съньвь Адама бывьдѣнъ.
[ja ˈdrŭʃtĭnŭ vŭˈzijæ ˈsexanŭ naˈbrŭgŭ ja ˈrʲæzĭdŭ ˈxʋorʲa ˈsŭnʲĭvĭ ˈadama ˈbɯvĭdænŭ]
and lord descend-3SG.PST see-INF on city-ACC and tower-ACC which-PL.ACC-NEUT son-PL adam-GEN build-3PL.PST
And the Lord came down to see the city and the tower that the sons of Adam had built.

7

Ия скѫчьда мь хъжи я сомовьщоу, я на имъ дрибанъ сє янъ ѫтєромѣ въ зѣщѣ броутѣрѣда.
[ˈjĭja ˈskõt͡ʃĭda mĭˈxŭʒi ja ˈsomoˌvĭʃtu ja naˈjĭmŭ ˈdrʲibanŭse ˈjænŭ ˈõteromæ vŭˈzæʃtæ ˈbrutærʲæda]
3PL-NEUT gift-PST.PART-3PL.NEUT with reason-INST and conscience-INST and on 3PL-DAT behave-INF REFL one other-DAT in spirit-DAT brotherhood-GEN
They are endowed with reason and conscience and should act towards one another in a spirit of brotherhood.

8

Инафравѣ гроунѣ тѫща слѣпѫдь тръноу.
[jinaˈfravæ ˈgrunʲæ ˈtõʃta ˈslʲæpõdĭ trŭˈnu]
without.colour-PL green-PL idea-PL sleep-3PL.PRS anger-INST
Colourless green ideas sleep furiously.

9

Мино флюутобѣтъ фъльдъ яломь.
[ˈmino ˈflʲutoˌbætŭ fŭlʲĭˈdo ˈjælomĭ]
my float.boat fill-PST.PART eel-PL.INST
My hovercraft is full of eels.

10

Могъ стрѣкоудѣ мовюу вьдъ чьнъ я късьдѣ ѥза вѫго.
[ˈmogŭ ˈstrʲækudæ ˈmovju ˈvĭdŭ ˈt͡ʃĭnŭ ja kŭsĭˈdæ ˈjeza ˈvõgo]
boy caress-3SG.PST girl-ACC along chin-ACC and kiss-3SG.PST 3SG.FEM-GEN cheek-ACC
The boy stroked the girl on [along] the chin and kissed her on the cheek.

11

Зъфърь кънѧзоричь, мощь я влътъ сѧдъ ѫзєра, ноу я ная.
[zŭˈfŭrʲĭ ˈkŭnẽzoˌrʲit͡ʃĭ ˈmoʃtĭ ja ˈvlŭtŭ ˈsẽdŭ ˈõzera nu ja ˈnajæ]
because kingdom might and glory be-3PL.PRS thy-NEUT.PL now and forever
For the kingdom, the power and the glory are yours, now and forever.

12

Я шѧдь то, Локи драньдѣ сє въ фръшѣ Франанга, хъльдъ свѣ лошь, я торъ ѫзьвь фѫгоунъ ѩ. И восъ бѫдонъ трамомь ѥ съноу Вали, тоухъ ѥ сънъ Нарфи вратъ врагоу.
[ja ˈʃẽdĭ to ˈloki ˈdranĭdæse vŭ frŭˈʃæ ˈfranaŋga ˈxŭlĭdŭ sʋæ ˈloʃĭ ja ˈtorŭ ˈõzĭvĭ ˈfõgunŭ jẽ jĭ ˈvosŭ ˈbõdonŭ ˈtramomĭ je sŭˈnu ˈvali ˈtuxŭ je ˈsŭnŭ ˈnarfi ˈvratŭ ˈvragu]
and after DIST-GEN loki conceal-3SG.PST REFL in waterfall-DAT franang-GEN disguise-PST.PART like salmon, and there god-PL capture-3PL.PST 3SG-MASC.ACC and be-3SG.PST bind-PST.PART intestine-PL.INST 3SG-MASC.GEN son-GEN vali but 3SG-MASC.GEN son narfi become-3SG.PST wolf-INST
And after that Loki hid himself in Franang's waterfall in the guise of a salmon, and there the gods took him. He was bound with the bowels of his son Vali, but his son Narfi was changed to a wolf.

13

Мина хѫдъ исть въ врамѣжѣ вощѣ.
[ˈmina ˈxõdŭ ˈjistĭ vŭˈvramæʒæ ˈvoʃtæ]
my hand be-3SG.PRS in warm-DAT water-DAT
My hand is in warm water.

14

Юбѣ монъ вѫда ѫтєраноу монъ въ хвилѣ то кънѧзь исть въ ѫхрѧзѣ, на имѣ жлѣданъ фърь вѫдоу въ трєвѣ мь логоу.
[ˈjobæ ˈmonŭ ˈvõda ˈõteranu ˈmonŭ ˈvŭ ˈxʋilʲæ to ˈkŭnʲẽzĭ ˈjistĭ vŭ.ɔ̃ˈxrʲẽʒæ najĭˈmæ ˈʒlʲædanŭ ˈfŭrʲĭ ˈvõdu vŭˈtrʲevæ mĭˈlogu]
if man wound-3SG.PRS-SUBJ other-ACC man-ACC in time-DAT SUBJ king be-3SG.PRS in province-DAT on 3SG-MASC.DAT pay-INF for wound-ACC in truth-DAT with law-INST
If a man wounds another man while the king is in the province he shall pay a fine for the wound in accordance with the law.
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Re: A Germanic Translation Comparison

Post by Salmoneus » Tue 20 Dec 2016, 19:15

Well that's... different. I can barely recognise a few words here and there. Has 90% of the Germanic vocabulary been replaced en masse, or have there just been a few millennia of really radical sound changes?
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Re: A Germanic Translation Comparison

Post by Void » Tue 20 Dec 2016, 20:30

Salmoneus wrote:Well that's... different. I can barely recognise a few words here and there. Has 90% of the Germanic vocabulary been replaced en masse, or have there just been a few millennia of really radical sound changes?
100% Germanic vocabulary. The language was simply subject to an extensive system of Slavic-based sound changes (similar to PBS > PS > OCS).
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Re: A Germanic Translation Comparison

Post by Creyeditor » Wed 21 Dec 2016, 01:25

This is my Germlang. I don't think it belongs to any established subfamily, but it shares some properties Old Saxon, Old Norse and Gothic. It has some unique innovations though.

1. Sang emenas rikes vatvareng ja sang makares valzang ja es menommeng no azjanang skolom
/səŋ emenəs rikəs vatvəreŋ jə səŋ makəres valzəŋ jə es menomːeŋ no azjənəŋ skolom/
[sə.ŋ‿ˈe.mɜns ˈriks ˈvat.vrɜŋ jə səŋ ˈma.krɜs ˈval.zəŋ j‿ɜs ˈme.nɞm.ːɜŋ nɞ ˈa.ʒəŋ ˈsko.lɞm]
sa-ng emenas rike-s vatv-are-ng ja makare-s valz-ang ja es men-omme-ng no azj-anang skol-om
3SG.M-ACC heaven-GEN.SG kingdom-GEN.SG guard-NMLZ.A-ACC.SG and creator-GEN.SG might-ACC.SG and 3SG.GEN mean-NMLZ.ABSTR-ACC.SG now praise-INF should-1SG.PRS
'Now we should praise the warden of the kingdom of heaven, the might of the creator and his purpose'

8. Grone satelonez eno blivam svef-anze rese.
/grone satelonez eno blivəm svefənze rese/
[ˈgro.nɜ ˈsa.tɜ.lɞ.nɜ.z‿ɜ.nɞ ˈbli.vəm ˈsve.fən.zɜ ˈre.sɜ]
gron-e sat-elon-ez eno bliv-am svef-anze res-e
green-PL thought-DIM-PL without colour-PL.DAT sleep-3PL.SG angry-ADVLZ
'Colourless green ideas sleep furiously.'

13. Mino monzo lese en a varmong
/mino monzo lese en a varmoŋ/
[mi.nɞ mon.zɞ le.sɜ ː.n‿a var.mɞŋ]
min-o hand le-se en a varm-o-ng.
1SG.POR-F.PUM COP.LOC-3SG.PRS in water warm-F.SG-ACC
'My hand is in warm water.'

Here is a list of words that I used with the corresponding proto forms.
Spoiler:
-are - *-ārijaz - agent nominalization
-elong - *-ilǭ - diminutive suffix
-omme - *-umnijō - deverbal action nominalization
a - *ahwō - water
azjanang - *hazjaną - to praise, to shout out
blivang - *blīwą - colour, hue
emen - *himinaz - sky, heaven, paradise
en - pp.dat - in, inside of
eno - *enu -without
gron - *grōniz - green
ja - *jahw - and
lenang - to be in a place; sit, stand, lie
makonang - *makōną - to create, to build
makare - makonang + are - creator; carpenter, craftsman
menenang - *mainijaną - to mean, to signify, to have a purpose
menomme -menenang + omme - meaning; purpose, goal
monzo - *mundō - hand
no - *nu - now
res - *wraiþaz - angry, furious
rikeng - *rīkiją - kingdom, realm, empire
sat -*þanhtaz - thought, idea
satelong - sat + elong - a little thought, a small idea
skolanang - *skulaną - to be obliged to
svefanang - *swefaną - to sleep, to nap
valzang - *waldą - might, authority
varm - *warmaz - warm
vatvare - vatvenang + are - guard
vatvenang - *wahtwijaną - to protect, defend
If you have an oppinion on it, feel free to tell me.
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Re: A Germanic Translation Comparison

Post by Salmoneus » Wed 21 Dec 2016, 15:20

Creyeditor wrote:This is my Germlang. I don't think it belongs to any established subfamily, but it shares some properties Old Saxon, Old Norse and Gothic. It has some unique innovations though.

1. Sang emenas rikes vatvareng ja sang makares valzang ja es menommeng no azjanang skolom
/səŋ emenəs rikəs vatvəreŋ jə səŋ makəres valzəŋ jə es menomːeŋ no azjənəŋ skolom/
[sə.ŋ‿ˈe.mɜns ˈriks ˈvat.vrɜŋ jə səŋ ˈma.krɜs ˈval.zəŋ j‿ɜs ˈme.nɞm.ːɜŋ nɞ ˈa.ʒəŋ ˈsko.lɞm]
sa-ng emenas rike-s vatv-are-ng ja makare-s valz-ang ja es men-omme-ng no azj-anang skol-om
3SG.M-ACC heaven-GEN.SG kingdom-GEN.SG guard-NMLZ.A-ACC.SG and creator-GEN.SG might-ACC.SG and 3SG.GEN mean-NMLZ.ABSTR-ACC.SG now praise-INF should-1SG.PRS
'Now we should praise the warden of the kingdom of heaven, the might of the creator and his purpose'

8. Grone satelonez eno blivam svef-anze rese.
/grone satelonez eno blivəm svefənze rese/
[ˈgro.nɜ ˈsa.tɜ.lɞ.nɜ.z‿ɜ.nɞ ˈbli.vəm ˈsve.fən.zɜ ˈre.sɜ]
gron-e sat-elon-ez eno bliv-am svef-anze res-e
green-PL thought-DIM-PL without colour-PL.DAT sleep-3PL.SG angry-ADVLZ
'Colourless green ideas sleep furiously.'

13. Mino monzo lese en a varmong
/mino monzo lese en a varmoŋ/
[mi.nɞ mon.zɞ le.sɜ ː.n‿a var.mɞŋ]
min-o hand le-se en a varm-o-ng.
1SG.POR-F.PUM COP.LOC-3SG.PRS in water warm-F.SG-ACC
'My hand is in warm water.'

Here is a list of words that I used with the corresponding proto forms.
Spoiler:
-are - *-ārijaz - agent nominalization
-elong - *-ilǭ - diminutive suffix
-omme - *-umnijō - deverbal action nominalization
a - *ahwō - water
azjanang - *hazjaną - to praise, to shout out
blivang - *blīwą - colour, hue
emen - *himinaz - sky, heaven, paradise
en - pp.dat - in, inside of
eno - *enu -without
gron - *grōniz - green
ja - *jahw - and
lenang - to be in a place; sit, stand, lie
makonang - *makōną - to create, to build
makare - makonang + are - creator; carpenter, craftsman
menenang - *mainijaną - to mean, to signify, to have a purpose
menomme -menenang + omme - meaning; purpose, goal
monzo - *mundō - hand
no - *nu - now
res - *wraiþaz - angry, furious
rikeng - *rīkiją - kingdom, realm, empire
sat -*þanhtaz - thought, idea
satelong - sat + elong - a little thought, a small idea
skolanang - *skulaną - to be obliged to
svefanang - *swefaną - to sleep, to nap
valzang - *waldą - might, authority
varm - *warmaz - warm
vatvare - vatvenang + are - guard
vatvenang - *wahtwijaną - to protect, defend
If you have an oppinion on it, feel free to tell me.
Does it have a name?

The most striking thing of course is the fact that the language not only preserves final nasal vowels, and preserves their nasality, but even strengthens them with a restored nasal coda. I don't think that's something that happens that often, is it? Especially in a family with a tendency toward very strong initial stress.
I also notice you have a lot of mergers going on. I hope that doesn't give you too many homophones!
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Re: A Germanic Translation Comparison

Post by clawgrip » Wed 21 Dec 2016, 15:56

Ah, if only I had a Germlang.
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Re: A Germanic Translation Comparison

Post by Creyeditor » Wed 21 Dec 2016, 19:17

Salmoneus wrote:
Creyeditor wrote:
Spoiler:
This is my Germlang. I don't think it belongs to any established subfamily, but it shares some properties Old Saxon, Old Norse and Gothic. It has some unique innovations though.

1. Sang emenas rikes vatvareng ja sang makares valzang ja es menommeng no azjanang skolom
/səŋ emenəs rikəs vatvəreŋ jə səŋ makəres valzəŋ jə es menomːeŋ no azjənəŋ skolom/
[sə.ŋ‿ˈe.mɜns ˈriks ˈvat.vrɜŋ jə səŋ ˈma.krɜs ˈval.zəŋ j‿ɜs ˈme.nɞm.ːɜŋ nɞ ˈa.ʒəŋ ˈsko.lɞm]
sa-ng emenas rike-s vatv-are-ng ja makare-s valz-ang ja es men-omme-ng no azj-anang skol-om
3SG.M-ACC heaven-GEN.SG kingdom-GEN.SG guard-NMLZ.A-ACC.SG and creator-GEN.SG might-ACC.SG and 3SG.GEN mean-NMLZ.ABSTR-ACC.SG now praise-INF should-1SG.PRS
'Now we should praise the warden of the kingdom of heaven, the might of the creator and his purpose'

8. Grone satelonez eno blivam svef-anze rese.
/grone satelonez eno blivəm svefənze rese/
[ˈgro.nɜ ˈsa.tɜ.lɞ.nɜ.z‿ɜ.nɞ ˈbli.vəm ˈsve.fən.zɜ ˈre.sɜ]
gron-e sat-elon-ez eno bliv-am svef-anze res-e
green-PL thought-DIM-PL without colour-PL.DAT sleep-3PL.SG angry-ADVLZ
'Colourless green ideas sleep furiously.'

13. Mino monzo lese en a varmong
/mino monzo lese en a varmoŋ/
[mi.nɞ mon.zɞ le.sɜ ː.n‿a var.mɞŋ]
min-o hand le-se en a varm-o-ng.
1SG.POR-F.PUM COP.LOC-3SG.PRS in water warm-F.SG-ACC
'My hand is in warm water.'

Here is a list of words that I used with the corresponding proto forms.
Spoiler:
-are - *-ārijaz - agent nominalization
-elong - *-ilǭ - diminutive suffix
-omme - *-umnijō - deverbal action nominalization
a - *ahwō - water
azjanang - *hazjaną - to praise, to shout out
blivang - *blīwą - colour, hue
emen - *himinaz - sky, heaven, paradise
en - pp.dat - in, inside of
eno - *enu -without
gron - *grōniz - green
ja - *jahw - and
lenang - to be in a place; sit, stand, lie
makonang - *makōną - to create, to build
makare - makonang + are - creator; carpenter, craftsman
menenang - *mainijaną - to mean, to signify, to have a purpose
menomme -menenang + omme - meaning; purpose, goal
monzo - *mundō - hand
no - *nu - now
res - *wraiþaz - angry, furious
rikeng - *rīkiją - kingdom, realm, empire
sat -*þanhtaz - thought, idea
satelong - sat + elong - a little thought, a small idea
skolanang - *skulaną - to be obliged to
svefanang - *swefaną - to sleep, to nap
valzang - *waldą - might, authority
varm - *warmaz - warm
vatvare - vatvenang + are - guard
vatvenang - *wahtwijaną - to protect, defend
If you have an oppinion on it, feel free to tell me.
Does it have a name?

The most striking thing of course is the fact that the language not only preserves final nasal vowels, and preserves their nasality, but even strengthens them with a restored nasal coda. I don't think that's something that happens that often, is it? Especially in a family with a tendency toward very strong initial stress.
I also notice you have a lot of mergers going on. I hope that doesn't give you too many homophones!
Thank you for your feedback [:)]

The project name is Spear language (aka Speersprache), because some people trace the word Germanic back to *gēr-manni 'spear man'. I actually liked the project name, so the 'in world' name might just be Sperenjas Razzo (cf. below).

I think something similar to the nasal strengthening happens in the adaption of loanwords from French to German. At least that's where I drew the inspiration from.

I don't have too many lexical homophones right now, but some of the paradigms are nicely simplified. I'm thinking about introducing a round of phonemic schwa deletion and vowel centralization plus word final devoicing. Do you think, that would be to mainstream Germanic?
Spoiler:
-enja -*-ingaz - belonging to, descending from
razzo - *razdō - language
sperenja - spero + enja - the spear people
spero - *speru - spear
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Re: A Germanic Translation Comparison

Post by Salmoneus » Thu 22 Dec 2016, 00:42

Creyeditor wrote:
The project name is Spear language (aka Speersprache), because some people trace the word Germanic back to *gēr-manni 'spear man'.
C.f. "Frank" ('javelin') and "Saxon" ('dagger').
I'm thinking about introducing a round of phonemic schwa deletion and vowel centralization plus word final devoicing. Do you think, that would be to mainstream Germanic?
The first two at least, it would surprise me if they were absent in a germlang. They're not universal (Icelandic iirc manages to keep most of its vowels?) but they're the norm. The third item would also be unsurprising, particularly if it's a continental language.

However, whether something is "too mainstream" is subjective, and depends on your purpose. If you want to make a bizarro-germlang, then yes, they're too mainstream. If you want to make something like Koulesch, which looks like it might be mutually intelligible with German, then no, they're not too mainstream!
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