με λόγια ελληνικά

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Lambuzhao
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Re: με λόγια ελληνικά

Post by Lambuzhao » 07 Dec 2014 21:03

@ Atman, Sangi, SLiV ϗ Egerius-

Here's a very rough translation of Mark 1:1-5 in Griko/Grecanic/Grico Salentino. Some kindling for the Yuletide fire.

1 Ntzignì to vangello tu Iesò tu Hristò Pedì u Teò
2 Pos Isaía u Profeta gràfase: Vlepi! pèfto ton angelòmmu,
pu stiàzzi ti stra proi sas.
3 Fonì pu fonazzi sto daso:
Stiàzzete ti stra tu Teò, tartèzzete e straliddhé.
4Evàttase sto daso, ce mìlase tu vattimo pos u Teò efsehori us tes amarfìe-tus
5Arti pa’stes zone tis Iudaia , ce vàttase us sta nerà Iordan ,ce cùase e tzemolisìe tos amarfìe-tus.

Spoiler:
begin-PRS.3SG DEF.N.NOM <gospel> DEF.M.GEN <Jesus> DEF.M.GEN<Christ> son DEF.M.GEN god
CNJ <Isaia> DEF.M.NOM <prophet> write-PST.3SG | look-PRS.2SG | send-PRS.1SG DEF.M.ACC <messenger>=1PL.GEN
REL prepare-PRS.3SG DEF.F.ACC way PRP 2SG.DAT
voice REL call-PRS.3SG PRP=DEF.N.ACC woods
prepare-PRS.2PL DEF.F.ACC.SG way DEF.M.GEN god | straight<VBLZ>PRS.2PL DEF.F.ACC.PL path-PL

<PST>baptize<PST>3SG PRP=DEF.N.ACC forest CNJ speak<PST>3SG DEF.M.GEN.SG baptism ADV god forgive-PRS.3SG 3PL.ACC DEF.F.ACC.PL sin-PL=3PL.GEN
come-PST.3SG all PRP=DEF.F.PL.ACC region-PL DEF.F.GEN.SG <Judea> CNJ baptize<PST>3SG 3PL.ACC PRP=DEF.N.PL.ACC
water-PL <Jordan> CNJ hear<PST>3SG DEF.F.ACC.PL confession-PL DEF.GEN.PL sin-PL=3PL.GEN
[;)]


*NB- Basically everything in <> is a blatant rip-off of one kind or another from :ell:.
[:$]

èpu ìse, Tzakonika?
Quo vadis, Tsaconica?
[:x]

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Lambuzhao
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Re: με λόγια ελληνικά

Post by Lambuzhao » 27 Jan 2015 11:59

http://www.urban.ro/wp-content/uploads/ ... _tb628.png
Αρτέμιος "Ντέμης" Βεντούρης Ρούσσος πέθαναν.

Ντέμης, βρείτε την ελευθερία σας

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iQ6Y80IfpVU

Ὅσον ζῇς φαίνου
μηδὲν ὅλως σὺ λυποῦ
πρὸς ὀλίγον ἐστὶ τὸ ζῆν
τὸ τέλος ὁ χρόνος ἀπαιτεῖ.
[:'(]

Αἰωνία ἡ μνήμη! Αἰωνία ἡ μουσική!

Artemios "Demis" Bendouris Roussos has died.
Demis, you found Tu Libertad-

As long as you live, shine
have no fear at all
Life is only a short thing
and Time seeks out its end

Eternal Memory! Eternal Music!

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atman
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Re: με λόγια ελληνικά

Post by atman » 27 Jan 2015 14:51

κακά νέα, κακά νέα [:(]

κλέος ἄφθιτον αὐτῷ, Forever and Ever
Երկնէր երկին, երկնէր երկիր, երկնէր և ծովն ծիրանի.

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Lambuzhao
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Re: με λόγια ελληνικά

Post by Lambuzhao » 27 Jan 2015 16:03

[mixing :grc: and :ell: a bit - liga liga!]

καλως ειπας, ω Φίλε μου,

ναί δη άφθαρτη δόξα εἰς τοὺς αἰῶνας τῶν αἰώνων.

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Lao Kou
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Re: με λόγια ελληνικά

Post by Lao Kou » 27 Jan 2015 16:27

atman wrote:κλέος ἄφθιτον αὐτῷ, Forever and Ever
Greek for "Come play with us, Danny."?

Image
κλέος ἄφθιτον αὐτῷ, Forever and Ever!
道可道,非常道
名可名,非常名

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Lambuzhao
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Re: με λόγια ελληνικά

Post by Lambuzhao » 27 Jul 2015 19:32

Image
Stolen-plans pyxis lid, approx. 1~2 b.b.y.

Ὀδύσσεια Βυβλίον IF.PΠF-

τὸν δ᾽ ἠμείβετ᾽ ἔπειτα πολύτλας δῖος Ϝαϊδήρ:
‘οὔ τίς τοι θεός εἰμι: τί μ᾽ ἀθανάτοισιν ἐΐσκεις;
ἀλλὰ πατὴρ τεός εἰμι, τοῦ εἵνεκα σὺ στεναχίζων
πάσχεις ἄλγεα πολλά, βίας ὑποδέγμενος ἀνδρῶν.

That's Odyssey 16:186, y'all
Spoiler:
Ϝαϊδήρ: poetically lengthened form of *Ϝαιδήρ, * Ϝαδήρ with a iota dialytica, on analogy of Ἀΐδης (poet) from Ἅιδης/ᾍδης.
Take that, Bembridge Scholars!
[<3] :mrgreen:
Last edited by Lambuzhao on 27 Jul 2015 19:58, edited 1 time in total.

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Lambuzhao
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Re: με λόγια ελληνικά

Post by Lambuzhao » 27 Jul 2015 19:50

Image
black-figure blue-milk amphora, ca. 20,687 a.b.y.

Ἰλιάς Βυβλίον A.A -

μῆνιν ἄϝειδε Ἰoδὰ Tατωϋίνεω † Ἀναχῖνος

Spoiler:
Cf. Iliad 1:1
Tατωϋίνεω : Some manuscripts have Παλπαϊτίνοιο instead. Viz. Utini & Espa, Codex Holocronica.
[<3] [xP]

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Znex
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Re: με λόγια ελληνικά

Post by Znex » 01 Aug 2015 15:09

χαίρετε, ὦ Ἐλληνισταῖ! εὑρεῖν ἐν τῇ ἑλληνικῇ κοινῇ λόγον καλόν τι πειρῶ ὡς «practise» τῇ ἀγγλικῇ ὡς ἐν «He practised his maths/playing the trumpet/meditating/being patient», ἀλλ' ἕν οὐ δύναμαι. οἴησθαι μόνον δύναμαι «μανθάνειν» καὶ «γυμνάζειν». ὑμεῖς οἴεσθε ἢ ἴστε ἄλλους λόγους;
Spoiler:
Heyo, Greek speakers! I've been trying to find a good Koine Greek word like English "practise" as in "He practised his maths/playing the trumpet/meditating/being patient", but I can't find one. I can only think of "μανθάνειν" and "γυμνάζειν". Can you guys think of or do you know any other words?
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Lambuzhao
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Re: με λόγια ελληνικά

Post by Lambuzhao » 01 Aug 2015 16:13

(δια)μελετάω… διὰ τί ȣχὶ δαί;;;
γυμνάζειν τε δὴ τέχνην ἐποίχομαί τε… ἴσως δὲ ȣϰ ἐν τῇ ἑλληνικῇ κοινῇ. :wat:

Spoiler:
(δια)μελετάω… why the heck not???
As for both γυμνάζειν τέχνην and ἐποίχομαι... mebbe not in Koine.
Depends how far you wanna bend the rules. Also, keep in mind, the trick is to sift out the “use/do customarily” (e.g. practice law, practice my craft/trade, practice fornication) verbs from the “train/repeat” verbs.
This may or may not help:
http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/def ... rget=greek
εὐτύχει
[;)]

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atman
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Re: με λόγια ελληνικά

Post by atman » 01 Aug 2015 16:18

Why not simply ἀσκῶ/ἀσκέω?

That verb has a pretty-looking conjugation in Atlántika, by the way:
Spoiler:
axco ['aʃko]
axques ['aʃkes]
axque ['aʃke]
axcòmin [ə'ʃkɔmin]
axquèti [ə'ʃkɛti]
axcòse [ə'ʃkɔse]
Երկնէր երկին, երկնէր երկիր, երկնէր և ծովն ծիրանի.

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Znex
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Re: με λόγια ελληνικά

Post by Znex » 01 Aug 2015 16:51

Lambuzhao wrote:(δια)μελετάω… διὰ τί ȣχὶ δαί;;;
γυμνάζειν τε δὴ τέχνην ἐποίχομαί τε… ἴσως δὲ ȣϰ ἐν τῇ ἑλληνικῇ κοινῇ. :wat:

Spoiler:
(δια)μελετάω… why the heck not???
As for both γυμνάζειν τέχνην and ἐποίχομαι... mebbe not in Koine.
Depends how far you wanna bend the rules. Also, keep in mind, the trick is to sift out the “use/do customarily” (e.g. practice law, practice my craft/trade, practice fornication) verbs from the “train/repeat” verbs.
This may or may not help:
http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/def ... rget=greek
εὐτύχει
[;)]
οἴμοι, ἤδη ἦλθον πρὸς Περσεῖ, καὶ ἐκεῖν' ἐστι τὰ εὑρημένα μου. [:(]

ἄ, «μελετᾶν» οἶδα καὶ φιλῶ, ἀλλ' οὐ βέβαιος πρὸς τοῦτο ἧν. ἐχ, καλλίον ἐστι ἢ οὐδέν.
Spoiler:
Ay, I've already gone to Perseus, and those before were what I came up with. [:(]

Ah, "μελετᾶν" I know and like, but I wasn't sure about that. Ech, it's better than nothing.
atman wrote:Why not simply ἀσκῶ/ἀσκέω?

That verb has a pretty-looking conjugation in Atlántika, by the way:
Spoiler:
axco ['aʃko]
axques ['aʃkes]
axque ['aʃke]
axcòmin [ə'ʃkɔmin]
axquèti [ə'ʃkɛti]
axcòse [ə'ʃkɔse]
καὶ οὐ βέβαιος πρὸς τοῦτό εἰμι. δοκεῖ μοι ὅτι «ἀσκεῖν» οὐ πολλάκις νομίζεται ἐν τῇ ἑλληνικῇ κοινῇ ἢ μετὰ τῆς ἴσης ἐννοίας.
Spoiler:
I'm not sure about this one either. It seemed to me that "ἀσκεῖν" isn't used often in Koine Greek, or with the same meaning.
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Znex
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Re: με λόγια ελληνικά

Post by Znex » 01 Aug 2015 18:30

καὶ τί ἡ διαφορὰ μεταξὺ «πῇ» καὶ «πῶς»;
Spoiler:
Also what's the difference between "πῇ" and "πῶς"?
:eng: : [tick] | :grc: :wls: : [:|] | :chn: :isr: : [:S] | :nor: :deu: :rom: :ind: :con: : [:x]
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Lambuzhao
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Re: με λόγια ελληνικά

Post by Lambuzhao » 01 Aug 2015 21:58

εἶεν σήμερoν σύγε πλήρης εἶ τῶν ἐρωτημάτων

Well now, aren't you the one full of questions today.

[:)]

oἴoμαι τὴν διαφορὰν μεταξὺ «πῇ» καὶ «πῶς» εἶναι περὶ τῆς πυκνότητος.
I think that the difference between the two is a question of frequency.

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Re: με λόγια ελληνικά

Post by Lambuzhao » 01 Aug 2015 22:07


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Re: με λόγια ελληνικά

Post by Lambuzhao » 01 Aug 2015 22:27

δοκεῖ μοι «ϖῶς» μὲν ταρφύστερόν τε ϗ ϖυκνότερον,
It seems to me that, on the one hand, «ϖῶς» is more frequent and common,


«ϖῇ» δὲ δήπȣ σπανιώτερον ἰδεῖν.
while to me perhaps «ϖῇ» is a rarer thing to behold.

ϖῶς δοκεῖς ;
How þinkest ðou?

:wat:

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Znex
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Re: με λόγια ελληνικά

Post by Znex » 02 Aug 2015 04:56

οὔ δ' ἐστι διαφορά ἐν ἐννοίᾳ;
Spoiler:
There's no difference in meaning though?
:eng: : [tick] | :grc: :wls: : [:|] | :chn: :isr: : [:S] | :nor: :deu: :rom: :ind: :con: : [:x]
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Lambuzhao
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Re: με λόγια ελληνικά

Post by Lambuzhao » 02 Aug 2015 15:20

« ϖῶς» μὲν βȣ́λεται λέγειν «ἐν ϖοίῳ τρόπῳ;» oἶμαι, «ϖῇ» δὲ « ἐν ϖοίῃ ὁδῷ;» .
Spoiler:
Viz. Smyth's handy CORRELATIVES chart @ §346

http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/tex ... apter%3D16



Two main differences:
1) Original case: ϖῇ is a fossilized DAT, while ϖῶς is a fossilized old ABL. I don’t know if there’s a shade of meaning we (as non-native anachromnistic speakers) miss, but, well, there it is: one difference.

2) In Smyth’s chart, he refers to ϖῇ as “Way”, as in “which way?” or “which direction?” Additionally, not in Smyth’s chart but in the Middle Liddell, it is also used like “To what end?” in Herodotus, and even rarely as “Where?” in Sophocles.



Smyth refers to ϖῶς with the word “Manner”, as in “what manner?” or “in what guise?”

It’s pretty much the go-to word for “How?”

Another Litmus test would be to access the texts themselves, and see what kinds of answers « ϖῇ» and « ϖῶς» generated. Sounds like a reasonable Classics/Tech research thesis.

:wat:

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Lambuzhao
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Re: με λόγια ελληνικά

Post by Lambuzhao » 06 Aug 2015 17:16

So that we may have some clearer idea

At least some of the crazy Greek alternate miniscule letter-forms have some more or less definite placements.

Initial Forms :

ϐ
ϑ
ϖ
ρ

Medio-Final Forms
β
θ
π
ϱ

So, for example, /'bar.ba.ros/ would be written


ϐάϱβαϱος


/θe.'o.θen/

ϑεόθεν


/'pi.pto:/

ϖίπτω


/re:.to:.ri.ke:/

ῥητωϱική


Gamma and Tau have alternate tall forms which seem to get used almost indiscriminately- anybody with a resource that nails the distinction in usage would be most appreciated [:D]

Jury's out on Kappa & Phi - Again, anybody have a reliable source to quote?
ϰκ / φϕ

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Znex
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Re: με λόγια ελληνικά

Post by Znex » 11 Aug 2015 00:32

χαίρετε, τοῦ "μέλλειν" ἐνθυμοῦμαι καὶ πῶς ἐργάζεται.
Hey again, I've been thinking about "μέλλειν" and how it works. (In Koine Greek and/or Attic Greek)

δοκεῖ σοι; εἶδον ταῦτα μεθερμηνευόμενα ὡς "going to" καὶ "about to"· πῶς δὲ ρελάτουσι μετὰ τοῦ μέλλοντος;
What do you think? I've seen it translated as "going to" and "about to". How does it relate (I dunno the Greek) to the future tense?
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Lambuzhao
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Re: με λόγια ελληνικά

Post by Lambuzhao » 11 Aug 2015 03:57

Tȣ̃το αὔϱιον μέλλω ἑϱμηνεύειν. [B)]

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