Metal Thread

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Re: Metal Thread

Post by Ànradh » 28 Aug 2014 21:53

Lambuzhao wrote:Aha. Creaky is that 'popping', well... creaky feeling in the back of the throat. Pretty much like how I would do a pterodactyl (well, one way).
Funny you should mention that; there's a screaming coach called Melissa Cross who begin to teach fry-screaming by asking people to imitate a pterodactyl.
Lambuzhao wrote:Sonically~vocally, is harsh voice (un)related to Tibetan multiple chant?
No idea, I'm afraid.
Xonen wrote:Neat. Have a /,,/.
Cheers. :)
Xonen wrote:Also, I'm pretty sure I can produce more than two different kinds of growls myself, but I don't really know which parts of my vocal apparatus I'm using to generate them. Plus some of them kinda hurt, which I'm told isn't supposed to happen. [¬.¬] Anyway.
As far as I'm aware, there are only four methods of producing screams, inhales, vocal fry, false chord and fry/false chord hybrids.
I spent a good few years trying to find a method that didn't hurt for me, but I'm fairly sure my attempts were all variations on either fry or false chord screams.
Pain is definitely bad though; it can lead to re-constructive surgery and the inability to speak above a whisper in a worst case scenario!
Teddy wrote:Opinions on deathcore/metalcore? Is it real metal? Do you enjoy listening to any bands in those genres?
I used to consider them to have split away from metal, but I've revised my opinion as I think they're too similar for that; metalcore sounds closer to death metal than British heavy metal, for example.
I'm not really a fan of either though. I like some old Bullet for my Valentine, but I went off Trivium and old Arch Enemy (I love the new album with that singer from the Agonist though).
On the deathcore side, I recently got into Whitechapel and Humanity's Last Breath, but that's the extent of it.
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Re: Metal Thread

Post by sangi39 » 28 Aug 2014 23:52

I've come to the conclusion that I'll probably get a new MP3 player of some kind in the near future. 8GB just isn't enough, especially since I have it playing for 8 hours when I'm at work. At the moment I've got about 24GB of music (all Metal of some form or another, or at least something like alternative rock bordering on metal, NDH, etc.) which, if I haven't missed anything, could last continuously, without repetition, for 8.5 days (if I then divide that by a rare 5 day week at 8 hours each day, I should have enough music to last just over 5 weeks without hearing a single song twice).

Basically, I'm getting sick of having to constantly change the music on my MP3 player, rather than just having it all on there. And I should probably leave room for at least another, what, 10GB, since I'm trying to build up my collection of music by quite a bit. Too much listening to music on youtube, which is all fine and well until the internet goes down [:P]

So far I've got every studio album released by Ajattara, Alestorm, Arch Enemy, Avatar, Baradj, Behemoth, Beneath the Massacre, Breaking Benjamin, Bullet For My Valentine, Children of Bodom, Chimaria, Daath, Deathstar, Delain, Dethklok, DevilDriver, Dimmu Borgir, Eisregen, Epica, Evanescence, Finntroll, Horned Almighty, Korpiklaani, Lacuna Coil, Lamb of God, Machine Head, Marduk, Meshuggah, Mokoma, Nightwish, Rage Against The Machine, Rammstein, Ruoska, Satyricon, Sepultura (but only up to and including Roots), Skalmold, Skindred, Svartsot, System Of A Down, The Nine Treasures, Turisas, Tyr, Verjnuarmu and Within Temptation. That's literally all the music I have, and when you write it down it doesn't seem like that much in the end [:P]

I'm looking to expand a bit more into NDH and there are a few more folk metal bands I'm looking into, and, to a lesser extent, a bit more death metal and black metal. My main bands of focus at the moment are Amon Amarth, Amorphis, At The Gates, Diablo, Ensiferum, Gojira, In Extremo and Tvangeste, as well as Stahlhammer, Unheilig and Tanzwut [:)]
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Re: Metal Thread

Post by Shemtov » 10 Sep 2014 14:30

My favorite Mëtäl:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=84aIX8UPklI
Thë rëst is sïlïëncë...............
Many children make up, or begin to make up, imaginary languages. I have been at it since I could write.
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Re: Metal Thread

Post by sangi39 » 11 Sep 2014 21:43

Shemtov wrote:My favorite Mëtäl:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=84aIX8UPklI
Thë rëst is sïlïëncë...............

Good choice, but I shall interrupt the silence with Karjajuht by Metsatöll [:)]
You can tell the same lie a thousand times,
But it never gets any more true,
So close your eyes once more and once more believe
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Re: Metal Thread

Post by Xonen » 16 Sep 2014 16:40

sangi39 wrote:
Shemtov wrote:My favorite Mëtäl:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=84aIX8UPklI
Thë rëst is sïlïëncë...............

Good choice, but I shall interrupt the silence with Karjajuht by Metsatöll [:)]
That link just takes me to an entirely silent Google page. [:S] Here's the interruption.

Returning to the theme of silence again, a song that's been playing in my head for various reasons over the past few days: Hiljaisuuden julistaja by Mokoma.

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Re: Metal Thread

Post by sangi39 » 16 Sep 2014 16:53

Xonen wrote:
sangi39 wrote:
Shemtov wrote:My favorite Mëtäl:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=84aIX8UPklI
Thë rëst is sïlïëncë...............

Good choice, but I shall interrupt the silence with Karjajuht by Metsatöll [:)]
That link just takes me to an entirely silent Google page. [:S] Here's the interruption.

Returning to the theme of silence again, a song that's been playing in my head for various reasons over the past few days: Hiljaisuuden julistaja by Mokoma.
Looks like I copied the wrong link and somehow never noticed [:P]

And Mokoma are awesome! I'm trying to remember how I first came across them. I don't think it was Scuzz, so it was probably through random youtube surfing, possibly through Korpiklaani, who have been played on Scuzz [:)]
You can tell the same lie a thousand times,
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Re: Metal Thread

Post by Shemtov » 24 Oct 2014 03:51

Many children make up, or begin to make up, imaginary languages. I have been at it since I could write.
-JRR Tolkien

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Re: Metal Thread

Post by sangi39 » 24 Oct 2014 20:57

Shemtov wrote:Beethoven Metal:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AdTQUt0BFB0
Not, IMO, as good as this bit of "Beethoven" Metal [:)] (although I'm not a fan of the lyrics/vocals, the music is pretty damn good)
You can tell the same lie a thousand times,
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Re: Metal Thread

Post by Chagen » 19 Nov 2014 18:23

Random bump time!

If you asked me I'd consider myself fully on the EDM side of the EDM-Metal spectrum, but there's some metal I can appreciate. Of course, the problem is figuring out what exactly counts as "true metal" as metalheads seem to spend more time arguing about what gets to be called "metal" and what doesn't.

For instance, would this count as metal? Most people I've talked to call it metal, but the band specifically calls themselves "Post-Hardcore" which doesn't appear to be a metal genre.
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Re: Metal Thread

Post by sangi39 » 19 Nov 2014 19:57

Actually, I think I'll wait until I'm in a better mood before I reply to this.
You can tell the same lie a thousand times,
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Re: Metal Thread

Post by Xonen » 20 Nov 2014 16:10

Chagen wrote:For instance, would this count as metal?
I can't immediately think of a reason why not. *shrug*

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Re: Metal Thread

Post by sangi39 » 20 Nov 2014 17:56

Xonen wrote:
Chagen wrote:For instance, would this count as metal?
I can't immediately think of a reason why not. *shrug*
I'm kind of with Xonen on this one. It's definitely on the "hardcore"-derived end of the spectrum.

My last comment, though, was in relation to this:
Chagen wrote:Of course, the problem is figuring out what exactly counts as "true metal" as metalheads seem to spend more time arguing about what gets to be called "metal" and what doesn't.
I don't see why you even had to bring that up, and we've already had a (brief) discussion about this sort of thing anyway. Some metalheads think like that, not all of us.
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Re: Metal Thread

Post by Chagen » 20 Nov 2014 19:43

Xonen wrote:
Chagen wrote:For instance, would this count as metal?
I can't immediately think of a reason why not. *shrug*
Ah, okay. I thought some parts like the normal singing vocals would discount it. Would you happen to know any other bands with a similar style? I love Foreground Eclipse but now they've disbanded sadly enough.

Sangi: Look, I'm just speaking from my own personal experience.
Nūdenku waga honji ma naku honyasi ne ika-ika ichamase!
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Re: Metal Thread

Post by sangi39 » 20 Nov 2014 20:10

Chagen wrote:
Xonen wrote:
Chagen wrote:For instance, would this count as metal?
I can't immediately think of a reason why not. *shrug*
Ah, okay. I thought some parts like the normal singing vocals would discount it.
Clean vocals do turn up in Metal, especially in, for example, Symphonic Metal and the earlier Metal bands of the 1970s and 80s and on into the 90s. The harsh vocal styles you find in bands like Lamb of God, Nile, Dimmu Borgir and the various hardcore-metal fusion bands are found mostly in the various Extreme Metal sub-genres (and fusions thereof) which have their origins in the 1980s, so they're a relatively recent development within the genre as a whole. Gothic Metal bands, for example, are quite well known for using both clean and harsh vocals in their songs.
Chagen wrote: Sangi: Look, I'm just speaking from my own personal experience.
Which is fair enough, but your personal experience still only covers some metalheads.
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Re: Metal Thread

Post by Xonen » 20 Nov 2014 21:58

Chagen wrote:
Xonen wrote:
Chagen wrote:For instance, would this count as metal?
I can't immediately think of a reason why not. *shrug*
Ah, okay. I thought some parts like the normal singing vocals would discount it.
What the... [o.O] You've been hanging out with some extremely narrow-minded self-proclaimed "metalheads", then? And have also somehow managed to avoid hearing any actually popular metal? [:D]

As sangi points out, "harsh" vocals have only been used since the eighties and only a few subgenres use them exclusively. Yes, there are kids who think nothing outside those subgenres is "true" metal, but that's just idiotic. Metal had been around for over a decade before growling even became a thing.

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Re: Metal Thread

Post by Micamo » 20 Nov 2014 22:33

Chagen wrote:Ah, okay. I thought some parts like the normal singing vocals would discount it. Would you happen to know any other bands with a similar style? I love Foreground Eclipse but now they've disbanded sadly enough.
They sing in English, but the song you linked sounds a lot to me like newer DragonForce stuff.

If you're specifically looking for a band that sings in Japanese, then I don't know of any. (I'm rather new to the metal scene myself.)
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Re: Metal Thread

Post by sangi39 » 20 Nov 2014 23:27

Xonen wrote: As sangi points out, "harsh" vocals have only been used since the eighties and only a few subgenres use them exclusively. Yes, there are kids who think nothing outside those subgenres is "true" metal, but that's just idiotic. Metal had been around for over a decade before growling even became a thing.
From what I've been able to gather, this seems to be a kind of reactionary attitude that goes along with Metal, in general, being a counter-culture (or a series of related counter-cultures), but an attitude you might find especially amongst those people who are actively going against the mainstream. The more they restrict their definition of what Metal is, the more they can argue against a culture they feel isolated from and, possibly, the more they can justify their isolation as the result of pressure from the mainstream to conform, despite feeling different. The less you have in common with them, the more you can say that you're an individual that stands alone, successful and proud, despite mainstream propaganda telling you that you must join the herd to survive. Putting it stereotypically, it's the "angry teenager" phase of being a metalhead.

But that's a wholly reactionary stage, and I think most people realise eventually that individuality is a good thing, they're not really being who they are and liking what they like because that's who they are and that's what they like, but because that's what other people aren't and what other people don't like, and at that point you're just defining yourself by everyone else's standard, just like everyone you thought was "too mainstream".

Sure, some people never get past that angst-ridden stage of mass isolationism through reaction because otherwise you'd become a "poseur" listening to "sell-outs" and "ingenuine assholes", two things that "fanatical metalheads" are dead-set against and define as a true test of worthiness and true metaldom. But at best they're a vocal minority, especially when talking about specific sub-genres.

The apparent "war" between Norwegian Black Metal and Swedish Death Metal, for example, AIUI, is effectively fought over who represents the most anti-mainstream position in terms of underlying ideology, vocal style and musical style, but it's a ridiculous series of arguments to be having because they both developed under the same general "aim" (to be counter-cultural), but developed different ways to achieve it.

One of the most insane arguments for hating Dimmu Borgir, for example, is that they have too many listeners and recorded basically every album after Stormblast in relatively high quality in a studio and started touring. "Oh my, this band has too many fans. I must listen to something more obscure." What kind of life is that?

Again, these people do exist, but they're hardly the best people to listen to when it comes to what counts as Metal, and most of them probably don't know the almost half-century-long history of the genre. When Dio died I saw so a handful of people going "that guy and his band suck", or something along those lines, and all I could think was, I don't like his stuff either, but he made a damn huge contributions to decades' worth of music. I expect to see the same thing when Ozzy Osbourne eventually dies in about three millennia [:P]
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Re: Metal Thread

Post by sangi39 » 20 Nov 2014 23:34

Oh, and on somewhat of a side note, one of my favourite stories in Metal came from Download a few years ago, not sure which year exactly, but basically Bruce Dickinson (Iron Maiden) was sat down having a chat with Robb Flynn (Machine Head) (note the cross-sub-genre niceties) and Robb Flynn told Bruce Dickinson that Iron Maiden was one of the main reasons he wanted to get into music seriously. Bruce Dickinson then turns round to Robb Flynn and says that his son, Austin I think (Rise to Remain) listened to a lot of Machine Head when he started forming and joining bands, but almost nothing by Iron Maiden. They seemed to look at this really well, with one generation influencing the next, who then go on to influence the next, forming an interwoven community. It's pretty cool when you think of it like that, rather than the fanatically reactionary rants of some people [:)]
You can tell the same lie a thousand times,
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Re: Metal Thread

Post by Chagen » 21 Nov 2014 02:17

Micamo wrote:
Chagen wrote:Ah, okay. I thought some parts like the normal singing vocals would discount it. Would you happen to know any other bands with a similar style? I love Foreground Eclipse but now they've disbanded sadly enough.
They sing in English, but the song you linked sounds a lot to me like newer DragonForce stuff.

If you're specifically looking for a band that sings in Japanese, then I don't know of any. (I'm rather new to the metal scene myself.)
Uh...huh.

I used to listen to Dragonforce and had two of their albums, but I stopped listening to them mainly due to learning about their supposed lack of actual talent.
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Re: Metal Thread

Post by Xonen » 21 Nov 2014 02:32

sangi39 wrote:When Dio died I saw so a handful of people going "that guy and his band suck", or something along those lines, and all I could think was
All I can think is that's not worth even thinking about. Reacting with that to someone dying doesn't even qualify you as a troll, more like some sort of fungus growing under the bridge. (Or, to be really charitable, about twelve years old and trying to appear macho. In either case, not really anything whose views I'd consider worth considering.)
I don't like his stuff either
I suppose that makes us enemies, then. [:(] Swords, pistols or battleaxes?

Although to be fair, I haven't really listened to too much of his stuff, either. I know the major hits and own this compilation from his time in Black Sabbath - and based on those, I'd say he was one hell of a singer - but I guess I'm not really a diehard fan. It's more about the principle of the thing.
I expect to see the same thing when Ozzy Osbourne eventually dies in about three millennia [:P]
Ozzy's been dead since '82, he's just been too blitzed to notice it himself. I fully expect him to hobble up on stage one of these decades and just suddenly crumble to dust.

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