Unnamed Mandarin Latin Hybrid Conlang

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Tmt97
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Unnamed Mandarin Latin Hybrid Conlang

Post by Tmt97 » 20 Mar 2013 19:25

I have made some progress on my unnamed Mandarin-Latin conlang, and I figured I would post it. For those who don't know it is meant to be an auxlang that is some kind of latin mandarin hybrid. The idea is to provide some mutual intelligibility to speakers of both mandarin and european languages. I think this is the first attempt at making a mandarin latin hybrid so even if I fail horribly atleast it will be unique.

Consonants
Nasals /m n ŋ/ <m n>
Stops /p b t d k g/ <p b t d k g>
Affricate /t͡s t͡ɕ /<x c>
Fricative /f s ɕ z h/ <f s sh z h>
Approximate /l ɻ j W/ <l r y w>

Vowels
/y u i o a ɘ/ <ü u i o a e>

Syllable Structure
(C/CC)(i,u)V(C/CC)(s)
meant C/CC to stand for a consonant or consonant cluster, however I was not sure how to write it correctly. If I was wrong please tell me the correct format.

I have decided on a SVO word order.
Adjectives will always come after the noun they modify.

I also have a few words, but I am still working on them, so I will probably post them as I complete them.
My general process is taking a meaning and finding the word in both languages. If they are significantly similar I try to merge them, if not I choose one. I try to make a fairly even balance between latin and mandarin words but word length also generally comes into the decision when choosing between the latin and mandarin word.

This is one of my first conlangs, so pointing out mistakes is greatly appreciated. [:)]
Last edited by Tmt97 on 20 Mar 2013 23:05, edited 4 times in total.

nmn
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Re: Unnamed Mandarin Latin Hybrid Conlang

Post by nmn » 20 Mar 2013 19:35

Why do you use the same letter for different phonemes?

Tmt97
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Re: Unnamed Mandarin Latin Hybrid Conlang

Post by Tmt97 » 20 Mar 2013 19:40

nmn wrote:Why do you use the same letter for different phonemes?
That depends on which one your referring to. The y, and u phonemes share the same letter because I was running out of letters to use and they seemed fairly similar. Do you have any suggestions?

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Re: Unnamed Mandarin Latin Hybrid Conlang

Post by mich2000 » 20 Mar 2013 20:40

Tmt97 wrote:
nmn wrote:Why do you use the same letter for different phonemes?
That depends on which one your referring to. The y, and u phonemes share the same letter because I was running out of letters to use and they seemed fairly similar. Do you have any suggestions?
Well, you could for example use <ü> for [y] or use the IPA values for the phonemes /y u j/.
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Re: Unnamed Mandarin Latin Hybrid Conlang

Post by nmn » 20 Mar 2013 21:01

I was referring to the C - Ch pairs.

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Re: Unnamed Mandarin Latin Hybrid Conlang

Post by Tmt97 » 20 Mar 2013 21:18

mich2000 wrote:
Tmt97 wrote:
nmn wrote:Why do you use the same letter for different phonemes?
That depends on which one your referring to. The y, and u phonemes share the same letter because I was running out of letters to use and they seemed fairly similar. Do you have any suggestions?
Well, you could for example use <ü> for [y] or use the IPA values for the phonemes /y u j/.
Thanks for the suggestion, I think I will do that!

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Re: Unnamed Mandarin Latin Hybrid Conlang

Post by Tmt97 » 20 Mar 2013 21:23

nmn wrote:I was referring to the C - Ch pairs.
I think that was my mistake, I didn't intend to have a distinction between those. I edited my post to fix it. [:)]

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Re: Unnamed Mandarin Latin Hybrid Conlang

Post by Tmt97 » 20 Mar 2013 21:34

If anyone has any ideas for a name, that would be greatly appreciated. All of the names I came up with sound weird. [:(]

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Re: Unnamed Mandarin Latin Hybrid Conlang

Post by hadad » 20 Mar 2013 21:50

What's your word for tongue? Language? Speak? You could any of those as a place to start.
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Re: Unnamed Mandarin Latin Hybrid Conlang

Post by hadad » 20 Mar 2013 21:51

What is the grammar like?
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Re: Unnamed Mandarin Latin Hybrid Conlang

Post by Prinsessa » 20 Mar 2013 21:55

nmn wrote:Why do you use the same letter for different phonemes?
Like English doesn't? :D It's not always necessary.
mich2000 wrote:
Tmt97 wrote:
nmn wrote:Why do you use the same letter for different phonemes?
That depends on which one your referring to. The y, and u phonemes share the same letter because I was running out of letters to use and they seemed fairly similar. Do you have any suggestions?
Well, you could for example use <ü> for [y] or use the IPA values for the phonemes /y u j/.
Why not just <y> itself?

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Re: Unnamed Mandarin Latin Hybrid Conlang

Post by xinda » 20 Mar 2013 22:03

/t͡ɕ/
/ʂ/
The selection of these two without either /ɕ/ or /tʂ/ is a bit strange since you would expect alveopalatals to pattern with each other, or retroflexes to pattern with each other. I think it would be better to choose either one set (/t͡ɕ/ /ɕ/, or /tʂ/ /ʂ/) or have all four in your inventory rather than choosing one from each POA.
/t͡s t͡ɕ /<x c>
I know romanization isn't that big of a deal, but pinyin uses /t͡s t͡ɕ / <c x>, respectively. It's fine if you don't want to change it, but personally I find the association a bit unintuitive.
I meant C/CC to stand for a consonant or consonant cluster, however I was not sure how to write it correctly. If I was wrong please tell me the correct format.
This is fine, but you will probably have to specify which kinds of clusters are allowable.
OSV
Any particular reason for this? Although Latin is a bit more free in terms of word order, Mandarin is pretty much always Subject first.


Looking forward to seeing how you deal with lexicon and grammar.
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Re: Unnamed Mandarin Latin Hybrid Conlang

Post by abi » 20 Mar 2013 22:09

Tmt97 wrote:I have decided on a OSV word order.
Why? Neither latin or madarin have that.

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Re: Unnamed Mandarin Latin Hybrid Conlang

Post by Tmt97 » 20 Mar 2013 22:41

Skógvur wrote:
nmn wrote:Why do you use the same letter for different phonemes?
Like English doesn't? :D It's not always necessary.
mich2000 wrote:
Tmt97 wrote:
nmn wrote:Why do you use the same letter for different phonemes?
That depends on which one your referring to. The y, and u phonemes share the same letter because I was running out of letters to use and they seemed fairly similar. Do you have any suggestions?
Well, you could for example use <ü> for [y] or use the IPA values for the phonemes /y u j/.
Why not just <y> itself?
I could do that, I chose ü because that is how it is expressed in pinyin, however it might be better to avoid diacritics. I'm not really sure which one would be best

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Re: Unnamed Mandarin Latin Hybrid Conlang

Post by Tmt97 » 20 Mar 2013 22:53

xinda wrote:
/t͡ɕ/
/ʂ/
The selection of these two without either /ɕ/ or /tʂ/ is a bit strange since you would expect alveopalatals to pattern with each other, or retroflexes to pattern with each other. I think it would be better to choose either one set (/t͡ɕ/ /ɕ/, or /tʂ/ /ʂ/) or have all four in your inventory rather than choosing one from each POA.
/t͡s t͡ɕ /<x c>
I know romanization isn't that big of a deal, but pinyin uses /t͡s t͡ɕ / <c x>, respectively. It's fine if you don't want to change it, but personally I find the association a bit unintuitive.
I meant C/CC to stand for a consonant or consonant cluster, however I was not sure how to write it correctly. If I was wrong please tell me the correct format.
This is fine, but you will probably have to specify which kinds of clusters are allowable.
OSV
Any particular reason for this? Although Latin is a bit more free in terms of word order, Mandarin is pretty much always Subject first.


Looking forward to seeing how you deal with lexicon and grammar.
These phonemes: t͡ɕ ʂ were a mistake. I will be choosing one of the sets. Thanks for catching that. I'm not the best at romanizing a phonemic inventory to be honest, so the romanization will probably change a lot before I get it the way I want it. I think OSV word order was a mistake made when I copied this over from my notes. I was going to keep mandarins word order. Again thanks for catching that.

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Re: Unnamed Mandarin Latin Hybrid Conlang

Post by Tmt97 » 20 Mar 2013 22:55

abi wrote:
Tmt97 wrote:I have decided on a OSV word order.
Why? Neither latin or madarin have that.
That was a mistake from when I copied information over from my notes. I will be using mandarins word order, I will edit the post to reflect that.

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Re: Unnamed Mandarin Latin Hybrid Conlang

Post by Tmt97 » 20 Mar 2013 23:13

hadad wrote:What is the grammar like?
I'm still working on that, at the moment all I have other than a few words, is on this page. The grammar is what I am working on right now, any suggestions are appreciated.

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Re: Unnamed Mandarin Latin Hybrid Conlang

Post by Tmt97 » 21 Mar 2013 00:57

Vocabulary update


Is: est
Mom: Mam
Not: Non
I: wo
That: gai

Suffix marking plural: men

These are a few of the words I have come up with. I found something interesting. The word for mom in Latin is mom, but the word for it in chinese is mama. It's a strange similarity, can anyone explain it or is this just an odd(but in my case useful) coincidence?

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Re: Unnamed Mandarin Latin Hybrid Conlang

Post by Lambuzhao » 21 Mar 2013 01:16

Tmt97 wrote: I found something interesting. The word for mom in Latin is mom, but the word for it in chinese is mama.

I thought :lat: mater, or more familiar mamma
:?:

Where did you happen to find :lat: mom ?
Suffix marking plural: men
This suffix always made me think of :lat: 3rd declension neuter plurals such as:
carmina songs
nomina names
tegumina coverings

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Re: Unnamed Mandarin Latin Hybrid Conlang

Post by Tmt97 » 21 Mar 2013 01:54

Lambuzhao wrote:
Tmt97 wrote: I found something interesting. The word for mom in Latin is mom, but the word for it in chinese is mama.

I thought :lat: mater, or more familiar mamma
:?:

Where did you happen to find :lat: mom ?
Suffix marking plural: men
This suffix always made me think of :lat: 3rd declension neuter plurals such as:
carmina songs
nomina names
tegumina coverings
I was going off of google translate, which upon closer inspection appears to be inaccurate. The suffix men is actually taken from mandarin.

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