Japoné語 - A Pastichelang Scratchpad

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Japoné語 - A Pastichelang Scratchpad

Post by Lao Kou » 12 Mar 2016 08:49

Image Japoné - A Pastichelang Scratchpad
........... (gueule)?

Okay, so it became fairly clear that after this exchange:
Lao Kou wrote:
clawgrip wrote:
Lao Kou wrote:(Japanese + joual? the world is waiting! [B)] )
Watashitez-moé la denwa, j'vais lui caller.
«電話» dja naille pas ca? (or even "dja n'est pas ca" [dʒɔ ne pɔ kɔ]?)
(denoué)
[dẽɪ̯̃we dʒɔ næɪ̯ pɔ kɔ] [xP]

私 oué Chinoé人 dja naille pas. (or "dja n'est pas" [dʒɔ ne pɔ]?)
(ouétachie) ...... (djine)
[wetæʃi we ʃɪnwedʒɪi̯n dʒɔ næɪ̯ pɔ]

Te nie dja 渡chita pas la 電話 au ca?
.............(ouéta) ........... (denoué)
[tœ̈ ni dʒɔ wetæʃɪtɔ pɔ la dẽɪ̯̃we oʊ̯ kɔ]

Okay, stop, Lao Kou, just... stop. :roll:
Edit: Look at me... stopping.
that I wasn't going to let it go, at least for this afternoon. [B)]

Let's leave a complete phonemic analysis aside for the nonce.

Edit: Gratias et kudos to Thrice for creating the Japoné語 flag and flag icon. [:D]
Last edited by Lao Kou on 15 Mar 2016 14:31, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: Japonoé語 - A Pastichelang Scratchpad

Post by DesEsseintes » 12 Mar 2016 08:51

Oh oh, I'm SO looking forward to this! [:D] [<3] [>_<] [xD]

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Re: Japonoé語 - A Pastichelang Scratchpad

Post by Lambuzhao » 12 Mar 2016 10:55

Japanoégueule oué tœttement omochiroi, nanze pas?
[->] gueule is sick [xP]
[<3] [<3] :!: {beaucoup aimeru}

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Re: Japonoé語 - A Pastichelang Scratchpad

Post by Lambuzhao » 12 Mar 2016 11:06

wunder if there are any attested morseaux from le cocopeuple:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/French_people_in_Japan

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Re: Japonoé語 - A Pastichelang Scratchpad

Post by Lambuzhao » 12 Mar 2016 11:18


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Re: Japonoé語 - A Pastichelang Scratchpad

Post by Lao Kou » 12 Mar 2016 12:03

Verbs:

会ë (aë) [a.œ̈] - meet
Spoiler:

Code: Select all

                Affirmative    Negative

Present:        会ë             dj'会ë pas 
Past:           会tta           dj'会tta pas
Future:         会ra            dj'会ra pas
Conditional:    会ré            dj'会ré pas
Imperative:     会ttez          dj'会ttez pas
Participle:     会tté           (dja) pas 会tté
Hortative:      会eau           dj'会eau pas
Pres. D. Pass:  会ouarèrë       dj'会ouarèrë pas
Past D. Pass:   会ouaréta       dj'会ouaréta pas
Pres. O. Pass:  est 会tté       dja est pas 会tté
Past O. Pass:   été 会tté       dja été pas 会tté
吸ë (souë) [sʊœ̈] - inhale
Spoiler:

Code: Select all

                Affirmative    Negative

Present:        吸ë             dja 吸ë pas 
Past:           吸tta           dja 吸tta pas
Future:         吸ra            dja 吸ra pas
Conditional:    吸ré            dja 吸ré pas
Imperative:     吸ttez          dja 吸ttez pas
Participle:     吸tté           (dja) pas 吸tté
Hortative:      吸eau           dja 吸eau pas
Pres. D. Pass:  吸ouarèrë       dja 吸ouarèrë pas
Past D. Pass:   吸ouaréta       dja 吸ouaréta pas
Pres. O. Pass:  est 吸tté       dja est pas 吸tté
Past O. Pass:   été 吸tté       dja été pas 吸tté
書quë (caquë) [kakœ̈] - write
Spoiler:

Code: Select all

                Affirmative    Negative

Present:        書quë          dja 書quë pas 
Past:           書ita          dja 書ita pas
Future:         書cra          dja 書cra pas
Conditional:    書cré          dja 書cré pas
Imperative:     書itez         dja 書itez pas
Participle:     書ité          (dja) pas 書ité
Hortative:      書queau        dja 書queau pas
Pres. D. Pass:  書carèrë       dja 書carèrë pas
Past D. Pass:   書caréta       dja 書caréta pas
Pres. O. Pass:  est 書ité      dja est pas 書ité
Past O. Pass:   été 書ité      dja été pas 書ité
渡së (ouétasë) [wetæsœ̈] - pass, hand
Spoiler:

Code: Select all

                Affirmative    Negative

Present:        渡së            dja 渡së pas 
Past:           渡chita         dja 渡chita pas
Future:         渡sra           dja 渡sra pas
Conditional:    渡sré           dja 渡sré pas
Imperative:     渡chitez        dja 渡chitez pas
Participle:     渡chité         (dja) pas 渡chité
Hortative:      渡seau          dja 渡seau pas
Pres. D. Pass:  渡sarèrë        dja 渡sarèrë pas
Past D. Pass:   渡saréta        dja 渡saréta pas
Pres. O. Pass:  est 渡chité     dja est pas 渡chité
Past O. Pass:   été 渡chité     dja été pas 渡chité
待tsë (matsë) [matsœ̈] - wait (for)
Spoiler:

Code: Select all

                Affirmative    Negative

Present:        待tsë          dja 待tsë pas 
Past:           待tta          dja 待tta pas
Future:         待tra          dja 待tra pas
Conditional:    待tré          dja 待tré pas
Imperative:     待ttez         dja 待ttez pas
Participle:     待tté          (dja) pas 待tté
Hortative:      待teau         dja 待teau pas
Pres. D. Pass:  待tarèrë       dja 待tarèrë pas
Past D. Pass:   待taréta       dja 待taréta pas
Pres. O. Pass:  est 待tté      dja est pas 待tté
Past O. Pass:   été 待tté      dja été pas 待tté
死në (chinë) [ʃɪnœ̈] - die
Spoiler:

Code: Select all

                Affirmative    Negative

Present:        死në           dja 死në pas 
Past:           死nda          dja 死nda pas
Future:         死ndra         dja 死ndra pas
Conditional:    死ndré         dja 死ndré pas
Imperative:     死ndez         dja 死ndez pas
Participle:     死ndé          (dja) pas 死ndé
Hortative:      死neau         dja 死neau pas
Pres. D. Pass:  死narèrë       dja 死narèrë pas
Past D. Pass:   死naréta       dja 死naréta pas
Pres. O. Pass:     --                 -- 
Past O. Pass:      --                 --
飲më (nomë) [noʊ̯mœ̈] - drink
Spoiler:

Code: Select all

                Affirmative    Negative

Present:        飲më           dja 飲më pas 
Past:           飲nda          dja 飲nda pas
Future:         飲ndra         dja 飲ndra pas
Conditional:    飲ndré         dja 飲ndré pas
Imperative:     飲ndez         dja 飲ndez pas
Participle:     飲ndé          (dja) pas 飲ndé
Hortative:      飲meau         dja 飲meau pas
Pres. D. Pass:  飲marèrë       dja 飲marèrë pas
Past D. Pass:   飲maréta       dja 飲maréta pas
Pres. O. Pass:  est 飲ndé      dja est pas 飲ndé 
Past O. Pass:   été 飲ndé      dja été pas 飲ndé 
乗rë (norë) [noʊ̯ʁœ̈] - ride
Spoiler:

Code: Select all

                Affirmative    Negative

Present:        乗rë           dja 乗rë pas 
Past:           乗tta          dja 乗tta pas
Future:         乗tra          dja 乗tra pas
Conditional:    乗tré          dja 乗tré pas
Imperative:     乗ttez         dja 乗ttez pas
Participle:     乗tté          (dja) pas 乗tté
Hortative:      乗reau         dja 乗reau pas
Pres. D. Pass:  乗rarèrë       dja 乗rarèrë pas
Past D. Pass:   乗raréta       dja 乗raréta pas
Pres. O. Pass:  est 乗tté      dja est pas 乗tté 
Past O. Pass:   été 乗tté      dja été pas 乗tté 
食bèrë (tabèrë) [tɔbæɛ̯ʁœ̈] - eat
Spoiler:

Code: Select all

                Affirmative    Negative

Present:        食bèrë          dja 食bèrë pas 
Past:           食béta          dja 食béta pas
Future:         食béra          dja 食béra pas
Conditional:    食béré          dja 食béré pas
Imperative:     食bétez         dja 食bétez pas
Participle:     食bété          (dja) pas 食bété
Hortative:      食béyeau        dja 食béyeau pas
Pres. D. Pass:  食bérarèrë      dja 食bérarèrë pas
Past D. Pass:   食béraréta      dja 食béraréta pas
Pres. O. Pass:  est 食bété      dja est pas 食bété 
Past O. Pass:   été 食bété      dja été pas 食bété 
呼bë (yobë) [joʊ̯bœ̈] - call
Spoiler:

Code: Select all

                Affirmative    Negative

Present:        呼bë           dja 呼bë pas 
Past:           呼nda          dja 呼nda pas
Future:         呼ndra         dja 呼ndra pas
Conditional:    呼ndré         dja 呼ndré pas
Imperative:     呼ndez         dja 呼ndez pas
Participle:     呼ndé          (dja) pas 呼ndé
Hortative:      呼beau         dja 呼beau pas
Pres. D. Pass:  呼barèrë       dja 呼barèrë pas
Past D. Pass:   呼baréta       dja 呼baréta pas
Pres. O. Pass:  est 呼ndé      dja est pas 呼ndé 
Past O. Pass:   été 呼ndé      dja été pas 呼ndé 
泳guë (oyauguë) [ɔjoʊ̯gœ̈] - swim
Spoiler:

Code: Select all

                Affirmative    Negative

Present:        泳guë          dja 泳guë pas 
Past:           泳ida          dja 泳ida pas
Future:         泳gra          dja 泳gra pas
Conditional:    泳gré          dja 泳gré pas
Imperative:     泳idez         dja 泳idez pas
Participle:     泳idé          (dja) pas 泳idé
Hortative:      泳gueau        dja 泳gueau pas
Pres. D. Pass:  泳garèrë       dja 泳garèrë pas
Past D. Pass:   泳garéta       dja 泳garéta pas
Pres. O. Pass:  est 泳idé      dja est pas 泳idé
Past O. Pass:   été 泳idé      dja été pas 泳idé
est [e] - be
Spoiler:

Code: Select all

                Affirmative    Negative

Present:        est            dja n'est pas/dja naille pas ? 
Past:           été            dja été pas
Future:         sra            dja sra pas
Conditional:    sré            dja sré pas
Imperative:     soéyez         dja soéyez pas
Participle:     été            (dja) pas été
Hortative:      soéyeau        dja soéyeau pas
"D. Pass" stands for "deleterious passive", the more Japanese way of doing it, so "die" can have a passive.
"O. Pass" stands for "Occidental passive", the more Occidental way of doing it. The present tense "est 書ité" may work like a regular Occidental passive as well as cover for Japanese's "書いてある".
Causatives and causative passives not accounted for yet, because it's a sketch.
Last edited by Lao Kou on 16 Mar 2016 15:55, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Japonoé語 - A Pastichelang Scratchpad

Post by Lao Kou » 12 Mar 2016 12:41

Some pronouns:

With the notion of topic/subject (は/が), object (を), and indirect object (に) [->] oué/ga, au, and ni:

Code: Select all

               私 (ouétachi) - I      君 (quimi) - you

Nom.           私 oué/ga              君 oué/ga
Acc.           m'au                   t'au
Dat:           me ni                  te ni
Independent:   moé                    toé
Not married to those citation forms.


渡chitez-moé ni le 電話.
Pass me the phone.

Te ni dja 渡chita pas le 電話 au ca?
Didn't I pass you the phone?

私 oué dja peut pas 話cë Japoné語. :?:
I can't speak Japonégueule.

私 oué dja 話cèrë pas Japoné語. :?:
I can't speak Japonégueule.

Lay waste to the gender system? If yes, "la", as in Esperanto, becomes the word for "the"; if no, I'd've gone with "le 電話" (though apparently, there are some gender hijinks in Canadian French).
Edit: June edit: No one commented, so the gender system is intact, and that's moved the lang in certain directions. No one to blame but yourselves. [}:D]
Last edited by Lao Kou on 27 Jun 2016 11:32, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: Japonoé語 - A Pastichelang Scratchpad

Post by Lao Kou » 12 Mar 2016 13:02

Lambuzhao wrote:Japanégueule oué tœttement omochiroi, nanze pas?
Seau n'est-ce n'est. [xP]
Lambuzhao wrote:any attested morseaux from le cocopeuple:
I'm cuckoo for cocopeuples!
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Re: Japonoé語 - A Pastichelang Scratchpad

Post by Lao Kou » 12 Mar 2016 13:38

Lao Kou wrote: 渡chitez-moé nie la 電話 au.
Pass me the phone.

Te nie dja 渡chita pas la 電話 au ca?
Didn't I pass you the phone?

私 oué dza peut pas 話së Japoné語 au. :?:
I can't speak Japonégueule.

私 oué dza 話sèrë pas Japoné語 au. :?:
I can't speak Japonégueule.
Yeah, already sounding like a cobbled nooblang I wouldn't abide. Let's bag "au" if the direct object isn't fronted and keep gender for the moment:

渡chitez-moé nie le 電話.
Pass me the phone.

Te nie dja 渡chita pas le 電話 ca?
Didn't I pass you the phone?

渡chitez le 電話 au Jean nie.
Pass the phone to Jean.

私 ga 見ta mon 父.
I saw my father.

私 ga 話chita mon 父 nie.
I spoke to my father.

Not great, but better. YMMV.

It's a sketch.
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Re: Japonoé語 - A Pastichelang Scratchpad

Post by Lambuzhao » 12 Mar 2016 13:53

Lambuzhao wrote:Japanoégueule oué tœttement omochiroi, nanze pas?
[->] gueule is sick [xP]
[<3] [<3] :!: {beaucoup aimeru}
Edit: [<3] [<3] {beaucoupp 愛sèrë}

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Re: Japonoé語 - A Pastichelang Scratchpad

Post by Lao Kou » 12 Mar 2016 14:17

Whatever a word for "he" might be:

Il ga m'au 見ta.
He saw me.

Il ga me nie 話chita.
He spoke to me.
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Re: Japoné語 - A Pastichelang Scratchpad

Post by Lambuzhao » 12 Mar 2016 15:09

il = kare ??

rui (lui) = kare:?:

rui々 (luilui)= ils, eux

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Re: Japoné語 - A Pastichelang Scratchpad

Post by Lao Kou » 12 Mar 2016 15:54

Lambuzhao wrote:il = kare ??
If one runs with caré and does the kanji thang: 彼

Nom: 彼 oué/ga
Acc: l'au
Dat: le nie
Independent: lui

then what of "elle"? 彼女 (canodjau)?

Nom: 彼女 oué/ga
Acc: l'au
Dat: la nie
Independent: elle

which might lead to 彼

Nom: 彼 oué/ga
Acc: les au
Dat: les nie
Independent: eux

and:

Nom: 彼女 oué/ga
Acc: les au
Dat: les nie
Independent: elles

Then 彼女 becomes one of those seemingly unrelated readings you just have to know. Such things are an issue that would need to be addressed, but I was hoping to be able to avoid it on the blush of the very first afternoon. [:'(]

Les cigarette oué, 私 ga les au dja 吸ë pas. :?: or Les cigarette oué, 私 ga dja les au 吸ë pas. :?:
Les cigarettes, je (ne) les fume pas.
タバコは私が吸わない。
I don't smoke cigarettes.
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Re: Japoné語 - A Pastichelang Scratchpad

Post by Sglod » 12 Mar 2016 16:54

This is good, but the orthography would be better as all Latin, or with more kanji IMO...

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Re: Japoné語 - A Pastichelang Scratchpad

Post by Lao Kou » 12 Mar 2016 17:15

Sglod wrote:This is good,
Thank you. A fun afternoon was had.
but the orthography would be better as all Latin,
Certainly a possibility, but would the morphology be utterly vaporized?
or with more kanji IMO...
I take your point, also a possibility (though at this stage, at least, I don't think the kanji : non-kanji ratio of text is that different from Japanese --

Les cigarette oué, ga les au dja ë pas.
タバコはわない。


-- the kanji/romaji mix (with ersatz French spelling) is definitely jarring to start), but then that's the whole issue of shoehorning kanji into a language for which kanji were not designed.

Open to suggestions. It's a sketch.
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Re: Japoné語 - A Pastichelang Scratchpad

Post by Thrice Xandvii » 13 Mar 2016 06:50

Sglod wrote:[...]but the orthography would be better as all Latin, or with more kanji IMO...
I have to whole-heartedly disagree. I happen to think that the orthography is deliciously atrocious. Yes, it is jarring and weird, but I kinda saw that as the point of the exercise. A kanji-usage in the neighborhood of how often it is used in your average colloquial Japanese sentence seems to be the sweet-spot to me. The difference of course, is that for your average kana you'll need 2-5 Latin letters to spell out the same sound in a French-esque way.
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Re: Japoné語 - A Pastichelang Scratchpad

Post by Lao Kou » 13 Mar 2016 10:07

行quë (iquë) [ˈikœ̈ - ˈɪkœ̈] - go
(quimie) [ˈkɪmi] - you
銀行 (guinequeau) [gɪŋˈkoʊ̯] - bank (f.)

君 oué dôcau nie tu ga 行tta ca?
[ˈkɪmi we ˈdoko ni t͡sy gɔ ˈɪt.tɔ kɔ]
2SG TOP where DIR 2SG SUBJ go-PAST INTERR
Toi, où t'es allé?
Where did you go?


(J'ga) 行tta la 銀行 nie.
[(ʒgɔ) ˈɪt.tɔ la gɪŋˈkoʊ̯ ni]
(1SG'SUBJ) go-PAST DEF bank DIR
(J')suis allé à la banque
I went to the bank.


A: Quimie oué dôcau nie tu ga itta ca?
B: (J'ga) itta la guinequeau nie.
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Re: Japoné語 - A Pastichelang Scratchpad

Post by DesEsseintes » 13 Mar 2016 13:58

Thrice Xandvii wrote:
Sglod wrote:[...]but the orthography would be better as all Latin, or with more kanji IMO...
I have to whole-heartedly disagree. I happen to think that the orthography is deliciously atrocious. Yes, it is jarring and weird, but I kinda saw that as the point of the exercise. A kanji-usage in the neighborhood of how often it is used in your average colloquial Japanese sentence seems to be the sweet-spot to me. The difference of course, is that for your average kana you'll need 2-5 Latin letters to spell out the same sound in a French-esque way.
[+1]

The mishmash effect is de rigeur here!

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Re: Japoné語 - A Pastichelang Scratchpad

Post by Thrice Xandvii » 13 Mar 2016 14:28

This looks amazing!
Lao Kou wrote:A: 君 oué dôcau nie tu ga 行tta ca?
B: (J'ga) 行tta la 銀行 nie.
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Re: Japoné語 - A Pastichelang Scratchpad

Post by Lao Kou » 13 Mar 2016 15:16

万歳 (banzaille) [bãˈzaj] - long live, huzzah
gôta混zé (gôtamazé) [ˈgotaˌmaze] - mishmash (m.)

Djâ, 万歳 le gôta混zé! [:D]
[dʒɑʊ̯, bãˈzaj lˈgotaˌmaze]
well, ten.thousand.years DEF mishmash
Bengadon, vive le méli-mélo!
Well then, long live the mishmash!
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