Quick Diachronics Challenge

A forum for all topics related to constructed languages
User avatar
sangi39
moderator
moderator
Posts: 3265
Joined: 12 Aug 2010 01:53
Location: North Yorkshire, UK

Re: Quick Diachronics Challenge

Post by sangi39 » 23 May 2019 19:27

Hoping people might be up for picking this back up [:)]
You can tell the same lie a thousand times,
But it never gets any more true,
So close your eyes once more and once more believe
That they all still believe in you.
Just one time.

shimobaatar
korean
korean
Posts: 11592
Joined: 12 Jul 2013 23:09
Location: PA → IN

Re: Quick Diachronics Challenge

Post by shimobaatar » 23 May 2019 19:48

Ah, sorry, I forgot all about this. I'd certainly like to try, although I'm not sure how well I'll do.

User avatar
sangi39
moderator
moderator
Posts: 3265
Joined: 12 Aug 2010 01:53
Location: North Yorkshire, UK

Re: Quick Diachronics Challenge

Post by sangi39 » 23 May 2019 19:51

shimobaatar wrote:
23 May 2019 19:48
Ah, sorry, I forgot all about this. I'd certainly like to try, although I'm not sure how well I'll do.
I'm mostly just hoping that a three months gap might have given people some spare time [:)]

And, hey, at least you've already made a start [:)]
You can tell the same lie a thousand times,
But it never gets any more true,
So close your eyes once more and once more believe
That they all still believe in you.
Just one time.

shimobaatar
korean
korean
Posts: 11592
Joined: 12 Jul 2013 23:09
Location: PA → IN

Re: Quick Diachronics Challenge

Post by shimobaatar » 23 May 2019 22:28

Not sure how I did, but this was fun, as usual. Sorry again for letting this game slip my mind, but I'm glad I had time to do it now.

Reconstructed words:
Spoiler:
(a) */ˈkʷilkʷila/
(b) */ʔaˈrendu/
(c) */tuˈkeedo/
(d) */ˈkʷila/
Sound changes per word (not necessarily all in the right order):
Spoiler:
(a) */ˈkʷilkʷila/
-/Vl/ becomes /o/, via /Vɫ/, before a consonant in 1-8.
-/o/ raises to /u/ when stressed in 2-3.
-/kʷ…kʷ/ sequences dissimilate to /p…kʷ/ in 2.
-/l/ becomes /n/ in 4-5.
-/kʷ/ becomes /k/ before /i/ in 2-3.
-/kʷ/ becomes /k/ before rounded vowels in 1 and 3-8.
-/u…i/ sequences assimilate to /u…u/ in 2.
-/kʷ/ becomes /p/ in 4-8.
-/p/ becomes /h/, via /ɸ/, in 7-8.
-/h/ becomes /ʃ/, via /ç/, before /i/ in 7.
-/k/ merges with /ʔ/ word-initially in 3-8.
-/ʔ/ is lost in 7-8.
-/kʷ/ becomes /w/ intervocalically in 1.
-/h/ is lost in the onsets of unstressed syllables in 8.
-/owi/ becomes /ou/ in 1.
-/oi/ becomes /ee/ in 8.
-/a/ is lost word-finally in 1-2.

(b) */ʔaˈrendu/
-/nd/ becomes /d/ in 1-2.
-/nd/ becomes /n/ in 3-4.
-/ʔ/ is lost in 6 in unstressed syllables, and unconditionally in 7-8.
-/r/ becomes /d/ in stressed syllables in 5, and unconditionally in 6.
-/r/ becomes /l/ in 7-8.
-Pretonic syllables are lost in 6-8.
-Final /u/ becomes /o/ in 4.
-/e/ becomes /a/ in 2-3.
-Final non-mid vowels are lost in 1-2.
-Final obstruent devoicing takes place in 1-2.

(c) */tuˈkeedo/
-/d/ becomes /r/ in 4-5.
-/ee/ becomes /ei/ in 1-4.
-/ee/ becomes /ie/ in 5-6.
-/ei/ becomes /e/ in 1-2.
-/e/ becomes /a/ in 2-3.
-/t/ lenites to /h/ in initial unstressed syllables in 1 and 6-8.
-/h/ is lost in unstressed syllables in 6-8.
-Pretonic syllables are lost in 6-8.
-/k/ palatalizes to /c/ before front vowels in 7-8.
-/c/ becomes /tʃ/ in 7.
-Final /o/ becomes /u/ in 2-3 and 8.
-Final /o/ becomes /a/ in 1.

(d) */ˈkʷila/
-/l/ becomes /n/ in 4-5.
-/kʷ/ becomes /k/ before /i/ in 2-3.
-/kʷ/ becomes /p/ in 4-8.
-/p/ becomes /h/, via /ɸ/, in 7-8.
-/h/ becomes /ʃ/, via /ç/, before /i/ in 7.
-/a/ is lost word-finally in 1-2.
Sound changes per language:
Spoiler:
1:
(a) /ˈkoul/
(b) /ʔaˈret/
(c) /huˈkeda/
(d) /ˈkʷil/

-/Vl/ becomes /o/, via /Vɫ/, before a consonant (*/ˈkʷilkʷila/ > */ˈkʷokʷila/).
-/kʷ/ becomes /k/ before rounded vowels. (*/ˈkʷokʷila/ > */ˈkokʷila/).
-/kʷ/ becomes /w/ intervocalically (*/ˈkokʷila/ > */ˈkowila/).
-/owi/ becomes /ou/ (*/ˈkowila/ > */ˈkoula/).
-/nd/ becomes /d/ (*/ʔaˈrendu/ > */ʔaˈredu/).
-/ee/ becomes /ei/ (*/tuˈkeedo/ > */tuˈkeido/).
-/ei/ becomes /e/ (*/tuˈkeido/ > */tuˈkedo/).
-/t/ lenites to /h/ in initial unstressed syllables (*/tuˈkedo/ > */huˈkedo/).
-Final non-mid vowels are lost (*/ˈkoula/ > /ˈkoul/, */ʔaˈredu/ > */ʔaˈred/, */ˈkʷila/ > /ˈkʷil/).
-Final /o/ becomes /a/ (*/huˈkedo/ > /huˈkeda/).
-Obstruents devoice word-finally (*/ʔaˈred/ > /ʔaˈret/).

2:
(a) /ˈpukul/
(b) /ʔaˈrat/
(c) /tuˈkadu/
(d) /ˈkil/

-/Vl/ becomes /o/, via /Vɫ/, before a consonant (*/ˈkʷilkʷila/ > */ˈkʷokʷila/).
-/o/ raises to /u/ when stressed (*/ˈkʷokʷila/ > */ˈkʷukʷila/).
-/kʷ…kʷ/ sequences dissimilate to /p…kʷ/ (*/ˈkʷukʷila/ > */ˈpukʷila/).
-/kʷ/ becomes /k/ before /i/ (*/ˈpukʷila/ > */ˈpukila/, */ˈkʷila/ > */ˈkila/).
-/u…i/ sequences assimilate to /u…u/ (*/ˈpukila/ > */ˈpukula/).
-/nd/ becomes /d/ (*/ʔaˈrendu/ > */ʔaˈredu/).
-/ee/ becomes /ei/ (*/tuˈkeedo/ > */tuˈkeido/).
-/ei/ becomes /e/ (*/tuˈkeido/ > */tuˈkedo/).
-/e/ becomes /a/ (*/ʔaˈredu/ > */ʔaˈradu/, */tuˈkedo/ > */tuˈkado/).
-Final non-mid vowels are lost (*/ˈpukula/ > /ˈpukul/, */ʔaˈradu/ > */ʔaˈrad/, */ˈkila/ > /ˈkil/).
-Final /o/ becomes /u/ (*/tuˈkado/ > /tuˈkadu/).
-Obstruents devoice word-finally (*/ʔaˈrad/ > /ʔaˈrat/).

3:
(a) /ˈʔukila/
(b) /ʔaˈranu/
(c) /tuˈkaidu/
(d) /ˈkila/

-/Vl/ becomes /o/, via /Vɫ/, before a consonant (*/ˈkʷilkʷila/ > */ˈkʷokʷila/).
-/o/ raises to /u/ when stressed (*/ˈkʷokʷila/ > */ˈkʷukʷila/).
-/kʷ/ becomes /k/ before rounded vowels (*/ˈkʷukʷila/ > */ˈkukʷila/).
-/k/ merges with /ʔ/ word-initially (*/ˈkukʷila/ > */ˈʔukʷila/).
-/kʷ/ becomes /k/ before /i/ (*/ˈʔukʷila/ > /ˈʔukila/, */ˈkʷila/ > /ˈkila/).
-/nd/ becomes /n/ (*/ʔaˈrendu/ > */ʔaˈrenu/).
-/ee/ becomes /ei/ (*/tuˈkeedo/ > */tuˈkeido/).
-/e/ becomes /a/ (*/ʔaˈrenu/ > /ʔaˈranu/, */tuˈkeido/ > */tuˈkaido/).
-Final /o/ becomes /u/ (*/tuˈkaido/ > /tuˈkaidu/).

4:
(a) /ˈʔopina/
(b) /ʔaˈreno/
(c) /tuˈkeiro/
(d) /ˈpina/

-/Vl/ becomes /o/, via /Vɫ/, before a consonant (*/ˈkʷilkʷila/ > */ˈkʷokʷila/).
-/l/ becomes /n/ (*/ˈkʷokʷila/ > */ˈkʷokʷina/, */ˈkʷila/ > */ˈkʷina/).
-/kʷ/ becomes /k/ before rounded vowels (*/ˈkʷokʷina/ > */ˈkokʷina/).
-/kʷ/ becomes /p/ (*/ˈkokʷina/ > */ˈkopina/, */ˈkʷina/ > /ˈpina/).
-/k/ merges with /ʔ/ word-initially (*/ˈkopina/ > /ˈʔopina/).
-/nd/ becomes /n/ (*/ʔaˈrendu/ > */ʔaˈrenu/).
-/ee/ becomes /ei/ (*/tuˈkeedo/ > */tuˈkeido/).
-/d/ becomes /r/ (*/tuˈkeido/ > /tuˈkeiro/).
-Final /u/ becomes /o/ (*/ʔaˈrenu/ > /ʔaˈreno/).

5:
(a) /ˈʔopina/
(b) /ʔaˈdendu/
(c) /tuˈkiero/
(d) /ˈpina/

-/Vl/ becomes /o/, via /Vɫ/, before a consonant (*/ˈkʷilkʷila/ > */ˈkʷokʷila/).
-/l/ becomes /n/ (*/ˈkʷokʷila/ > */ˈkʷokʷina/, */ˈkʷila/ > */ˈkʷina/).
-/kʷ/ becomes /k/ before rounded vowels (*/ˈkʷokʷina/ > */ˈkokʷina/).
-/kʷ/ becomes /p/ (*/ˈkokʷina/ > */ˈkopina/, */ˈkʷina/ > /ˈpina/).
-/k/ merges with /ʔ/ word-initially (*/ˈkopina/ > /ˈʔopina/).
-/ee/ becomes /ie/ (*/tuˈkeedo/ > */tuˈkiedo/).
-/d/ becomes /r/ intervocalically (*/tuˈkiedo/ > /tuˈkiero/).
-/r/ becomes /d/ in the onsets of stressed syllables (*/ʔaˈrendu/ > /ʔaˈdendu/).

6:
(a) /ˈʔopila/
(b) /ˈdendu/
(c) /ˈkiedo/
(d) /ˈpila/

-/Vl/ becomes /o/, via /Vɫ/, before a consonant (*/ˈkʷilkʷila/ > */ˈkʷokʷila/).
-/kʷ/ becomes /k/ before rounded vowels (*/ˈkʷokʷila/ > */ˈkokʷila/).
-/kʷ/ becomes /p/ (*/ˈkokʷila/ > */ˈkopila/, */ˈkʷila/ > /ˈpila/).
-/k/ merges with /ʔ/ word-initially (*/ˈkopila/ > /ˈʔopila/).
-/ee/ becomes /ie/ (*/tuˈkeedo/ > */tuˈkiedo/).
-/t/ lenites to /h/ in initial unstressed syllables (*/tuˈkiedo/ > */huˈkiedo/).
-/r/ becomes /d/ (*/ʔaˈrendu/ > */ʔaˈdendu/).
-/ʔ/ is lost in unstressed syllables (*/ʔaˈdendu/ > */aˈdendu/).
-/h/ is lost in unstressed syllables (*/huˈkiedo/ > */uˈkiedo/).
-Pretonic vowels are lost (*/aˈdendu/ > /ˈdendu/, */uˈkiedo/ > /ˈkiedo/).

7:
(a) /ˈoʃila/
(b) /ˈlendu/
(c) /ˈtʃeedo/
(d) /ˈʃila/

-/Vl/ becomes /o/, via /Vɫ/, before a consonant (*/ˈkʷilkʷila/ > */ˈkʷokʷila/).
-/kʷ/ becomes /k/ before rounded vowels (*/ˈkʷokʷila/ > */ˈkokʷila/).
-/kʷ/ becomes /p/ (*/ˈkokʷila/ > */ˈkopila/, */ˈkʷila/ > */ˈpila/).
-/p/ becomes /h/, via /ɸ/ (*/ˈkopila/ > */ˈkohila/, */ˈpila/ > */ˈhila/).
-/k/ merges with /ʔ/ word-initially (*/ˈkohila/ > */ˈʔohila/).
-/t/ lenites to /h/ in initial unstressed syllables (*/tuˈkeedo/ > */huˈkeedo/).
-/h/ becomes /ʃ/, via /ç/, before /i/ (*/ˈʔohila/ > */ˈʔoʃila/, */ˈhila/ > /ˈʃila/).
-/k/ becomes /c/ before front vowels (*/huˈkeedo/ > */huˈceedo/).
-/r/ becomes /l/ (*/ʔaˈrendu/ > */ʔaˈlendu/).
-/ʔ/ is lost (*/ˈʔoʃila/ > /ˈoʃila/, */ʔaˈlendu/ > */aˈlendu/).
-/h/ is lost in unstressed syllables (*/huˈceedo/ > */uˈceedo/).
-/c/ becomes /tʃ/ (*/uˈceedo/ > */uˈtʃeedo/).
-Pretonic vowels are lost (*/aˈlendu/ > /ˈlendu/, */uˈtʃeedo/ > /ˈtʃeedo/).

8:
(a) /ˈeela/
(b) /ˈlendu/
(c) /ˈceedu/
(d) /ˈhila/

-/Vl/ becomes /o/, via /Vɫ/, before a consonant (*/ˈkʷilkʷila/ > */ˈkʷokʷila/).
-/kʷ/ becomes /k/ before rounded vowels (*/ˈkʷokʷila/ > */ˈkokʷila/).
-/kʷ/ becomes /p/ (*/ˈkokʷila/ > */ˈkopila/, */ˈkʷila/ > */ˈpila/).
-/p/ becomes /h/, via /ɸ/ (*/ˈkopila/ > */ˈkohila/, */ˈpila/ > /ˈhila/).
-/k/ merges with /ʔ/ word-initially (*/ˈkohila/ > */ˈʔohila/).
-/t/ lenites to /h/ in initial unstressed syllables (*/tuˈkeedo/ > */huˈkeedo/).
-/k/ becomes /c/ before front vowels (*/huˈkeedo/ > */huˈceedo/).
-/r/ becomes /l/ (*/ʔaˈrendu/ > */ʔaˈlendu/).
-/ʔ/ is lost (*/ˈʔohila/ > */ˈohila/, */ʔaˈlendu/ > */aˈlendu/).
-/h/ is lost in unstressed syllables (*/ˈohila/ > */ˈoila/, */huˈceedo/ > */uˈceedo/).
-Final /o/ becomes /u/ (*/uˈceedo/ > */uˈceedu/).
-/oi/ becomes /ee/ (*/ˈoila/ > /ˈeela/).
-Pretonic vowels are lost (*/aˈlendu/ > /ˈlendu/, */uˈceedu/ > /ˈceedu/).

ɶʙ ɞʛ
cuneiform
cuneiform
Posts: 77
Joined: 02 Aug 2019 18:47

Re: Quick Diachronics Challenge

Post by ɶʙ ɞʛ » 02 Aug 2019 19:35

Here's another one:

1- at’of, otsejes, inauf
2- at’ʊh, ɔtsʊiʃ, inauf
3- t’uf, tsu:ʃ, nɔ:f
4- aɗǝx, atsi:ç, inaux
5- at’uk, otsoits, inwok

6- at’ɨ:, tsø:ǝ, ino:.ɨ:
7- aɗɯ, dzoja, inawɯ
8- ali, zoe, ilau
9- anɨ, zoje, inowɨ
10- ats’i:, tʃe:a, inawi:

11- at’ɛθ, iʃoç, inauθ
12- t’ǝh, tsojǝh, nawǝh
13- ɗǝs, zoɉʝes, nab̪vos
14- lǝs, lodʒes, lavos
15- ɣɯ:, ɣoʒe:, ɣavo:
16- dıs, sɔdʒıs, nabʊs

17- tna, tʃʰaha, nwɔna
18- n̥a, ʃ:ehe, mon̥o
19- t’ah, s:jah, ⁿduǝh
20- atsa, os:ja:, ᵑɡwo:

User avatar
sangi39
moderator
moderator
Posts: 3265
Joined: 12 Aug 2010 01:53
Location: North Yorkshire, UK

Re: Quick Diachronics Challenge

Post by sangi39 » 11 Aug 2019 19:39

shimobaatar wrote:
23 May 2019 22:28
Not sure how I did, but this was fun, as usual. Sorry again for letting this game slip my mind, but I'm glad I had time to do it now.

Reconstructed words:
Spoiler:
(a) */ˈkʷilkʷila/
(b) */ʔaˈrendu/
(c) */tuˈkeedo/
(d) */ˈkʷila/
Sound changes per word (not necessarily all in the right order):
Spoiler:
(a) */ˈkʷilkʷila/
-/Vl/ becomes /o/, via /Vɫ/, before a consonant in 1-8.
-/o/ raises to /u/ when stressed in 2-3.
-/kʷ…kʷ/ sequences dissimilate to /p…kʷ/ in 2.
-/l/ becomes /n/ in 4-5.
-/kʷ/ becomes /k/ before /i/ in 2-3.
-/kʷ/ becomes /k/ before rounded vowels in 1 and 3-8.
-/u…i/ sequences assimilate to /u…u/ in 2.
-/kʷ/ becomes /p/ in 4-8.
-/p/ becomes /h/, via /ɸ/, in 7-8.
-/h/ becomes /ʃ/, via /ç/, before /i/ in 7.
-/k/ merges with /ʔ/ word-initially in 3-8.
-/ʔ/ is lost in 7-8.
-/kʷ/ becomes /w/ intervocalically in 1.
-/h/ is lost in the onsets of unstressed syllables in 8.
-/owi/ becomes /ou/ in 1.
-/oi/ becomes /ee/ in 8.
-/a/ is lost word-finally in 1-2.

(b) */ʔaˈrendu/
-/nd/ becomes /d/ in 1-2.
-/nd/ becomes /n/ in 3-4.
-/ʔ/ is lost in 6 in unstressed syllables, and unconditionally in 7-8.
-/r/ becomes /d/ in stressed syllables in 5, and unconditionally in 6.
-/r/ becomes /l/ in 7-8.
-Pretonic syllables are lost in 6-8.
-Final /u/ becomes /o/ in 4.
-/e/ becomes /a/ in 2-3.
-Final non-mid vowels are lost in 1-2.
-Final obstruent devoicing takes place in 1-2.

(c) */tuˈkeedo/
-/d/ becomes /r/ in 4-5.
-/ee/ becomes /ei/ in 1-4.
-/ee/ becomes /ie/ in 5-6.
-/ei/ becomes /e/ in 1-2.
-/e/ becomes /a/ in 2-3.
-/t/ lenites to /h/ in initial unstressed syllables in 1 and 6-8.
-/h/ is lost in unstressed syllables in 6-8.
-Pretonic syllables are lost in 6-8.
-/k/ palatalizes to /c/ before front vowels in 7-8.
-/c/ becomes /tʃ/ in 7.
-Final /o/ becomes /u/ in 2-3 and 8.
-Final /o/ becomes /a/ in 1.

(d) */ˈkʷila/
-/l/ becomes /n/ in 4-5.
-/kʷ/ becomes /k/ before /i/ in 2-3.
-/kʷ/ becomes /p/ in 4-8.
-/p/ becomes /h/, via /ɸ/, in 7-8.
-/h/ becomes /ʃ/, via /ç/, before /i/ in 7.
-/a/ is lost word-finally in 1-2.
Sound changes per language:
Spoiler:
1:
(a) /ˈkoul/
(b) /ʔaˈret/
(c) /huˈkeda/
(d) /ˈkʷil/

-/Vl/ becomes /o/, via /Vɫ/, before a consonant (*/ˈkʷilkʷila/ > */ˈkʷokʷila/).
-/kʷ/ becomes /k/ before rounded vowels. (*/ˈkʷokʷila/ > */ˈkokʷila/).
-/kʷ/ becomes /w/ intervocalically (*/ˈkokʷila/ > */ˈkowila/).
-/owi/ becomes /ou/ (*/ˈkowila/ > */ˈkoula/).
-/nd/ becomes /d/ (*/ʔaˈrendu/ > */ʔaˈredu/).
-/ee/ becomes /ei/ (*/tuˈkeedo/ > */tuˈkeido/).
-/ei/ becomes /e/ (*/tuˈkeido/ > */tuˈkedo/).
-/t/ lenites to /h/ in initial unstressed syllables (*/tuˈkedo/ > */huˈkedo/).
-Final non-mid vowels are lost (*/ˈkoula/ > /ˈkoul/, */ʔaˈredu/ > */ʔaˈred/, */ˈkʷila/ > /ˈkʷil/).
-Final /o/ becomes /a/ (*/huˈkedo/ > /huˈkeda/).
-Obstruents devoice word-finally (*/ʔaˈred/ > /ʔaˈret/).

2:
(a) /ˈpukul/
(b) /ʔaˈrat/
(c) /tuˈkadu/
(d) /ˈkil/

-/Vl/ becomes /o/, via /Vɫ/, before a consonant (*/ˈkʷilkʷila/ > */ˈkʷokʷila/).
-/o/ raises to /u/ when stressed (*/ˈkʷokʷila/ > */ˈkʷukʷila/).
-/kʷ…kʷ/ sequences dissimilate to /p…kʷ/ (*/ˈkʷukʷila/ > */ˈpukʷila/).
-/kʷ/ becomes /k/ before /i/ (*/ˈpukʷila/ > */ˈpukila/, */ˈkʷila/ > */ˈkila/).
-/u…i/ sequences assimilate to /u…u/ (*/ˈpukila/ > */ˈpukula/).
-/nd/ becomes /d/ (*/ʔaˈrendu/ > */ʔaˈredu/).
-/ee/ becomes /ei/ (*/tuˈkeedo/ > */tuˈkeido/).
-/ei/ becomes /e/ (*/tuˈkeido/ > */tuˈkedo/).
-/e/ becomes /a/ (*/ʔaˈredu/ > */ʔaˈradu/, */tuˈkedo/ > */tuˈkado/).
-Final non-mid vowels are lost (*/ˈpukula/ > /ˈpukul/, */ʔaˈradu/ > */ʔaˈrad/, */ˈkila/ > /ˈkil/).
-Final /o/ becomes /u/ (*/tuˈkado/ > /tuˈkadu/).
-Obstruents devoice word-finally (*/ʔaˈrad/ > /ʔaˈrat/).

3:
(a) /ˈʔukila/
(b) /ʔaˈranu/
(c) /tuˈkaidu/
(d) /ˈkila/

-/Vl/ becomes /o/, via /Vɫ/, before a consonant (*/ˈkʷilkʷila/ > */ˈkʷokʷila/).
-/o/ raises to /u/ when stressed (*/ˈkʷokʷila/ > */ˈkʷukʷila/).
-/kʷ/ becomes /k/ before rounded vowels (*/ˈkʷukʷila/ > */ˈkukʷila/).
-/k/ merges with /ʔ/ word-initially (*/ˈkukʷila/ > */ˈʔukʷila/).
-/kʷ/ becomes /k/ before /i/ (*/ˈʔukʷila/ > /ˈʔukila/, */ˈkʷila/ > /ˈkila/).
-/nd/ becomes /n/ (*/ʔaˈrendu/ > */ʔaˈrenu/).
-/ee/ becomes /ei/ (*/tuˈkeedo/ > */tuˈkeido/).
-/e/ becomes /a/ (*/ʔaˈrenu/ > /ʔaˈranu/, */tuˈkeido/ > */tuˈkaido/).
-Final /o/ becomes /u/ (*/tuˈkaido/ > /tuˈkaidu/).

4:
(a) /ˈʔopina/
(b) /ʔaˈreno/
(c) /tuˈkeiro/
(d) /ˈpina/

-/Vl/ becomes /o/, via /Vɫ/, before a consonant (*/ˈkʷilkʷila/ > */ˈkʷokʷila/).
-/l/ becomes /n/ (*/ˈkʷokʷila/ > */ˈkʷokʷina/, */ˈkʷila/ > */ˈkʷina/).
-/kʷ/ becomes /k/ before rounded vowels (*/ˈkʷokʷina/ > */ˈkokʷina/).
-/kʷ/ becomes /p/ (*/ˈkokʷina/ > */ˈkopina/, */ˈkʷina/ > /ˈpina/).
-/k/ merges with /ʔ/ word-initially (*/ˈkopina/ > /ˈʔopina/).
-/nd/ becomes /n/ (*/ʔaˈrendu/ > */ʔaˈrenu/).
-/ee/ becomes /ei/ (*/tuˈkeedo/ > */tuˈkeido/).
-/d/ becomes /r/ (*/tuˈkeido/ > /tuˈkeiro/).
-Final /u/ becomes /o/ (*/ʔaˈrenu/ > /ʔaˈreno/).

5:
(a) /ˈʔopina/
(b) /ʔaˈdendu/
(c) /tuˈkiero/
(d) /ˈpina/

-/Vl/ becomes /o/, via /Vɫ/, before a consonant (*/ˈkʷilkʷila/ > */ˈkʷokʷila/).
-/l/ becomes /n/ (*/ˈkʷokʷila/ > */ˈkʷokʷina/, */ˈkʷila/ > */ˈkʷina/).
-/kʷ/ becomes /k/ before rounded vowels (*/ˈkʷokʷina/ > */ˈkokʷina/).
-/kʷ/ becomes /p/ (*/ˈkokʷina/ > */ˈkopina/, */ˈkʷina/ > /ˈpina/).
-/k/ merges with /ʔ/ word-initially (*/ˈkopina/ > /ˈʔopina/).
-/ee/ becomes /ie/ (*/tuˈkeedo/ > */tuˈkiedo/).
-/d/ becomes /r/ intervocalically (*/tuˈkiedo/ > /tuˈkiero/).
-/r/ becomes /d/ in the onsets of stressed syllables (*/ʔaˈrendu/ > /ʔaˈdendu/).

6:
(a) /ˈʔopila/
(b) /ˈdendu/
(c) /ˈkiedo/
(d) /ˈpila/

-/Vl/ becomes /o/, via /Vɫ/, before a consonant (*/ˈkʷilkʷila/ > */ˈkʷokʷila/).
-/kʷ/ becomes /k/ before rounded vowels (*/ˈkʷokʷila/ > */ˈkokʷila/).
-/kʷ/ becomes /p/ (*/ˈkokʷila/ > */ˈkopila/, */ˈkʷila/ > /ˈpila/).
-/k/ merges with /ʔ/ word-initially (*/ˈkopila/ > /ˈʔopila/).
-/ee/ becomes /ie/ (*/tuˈkeedo/ > */tuˈkiedo/).
-/t/ lenites to /h/ in initial unstressed syllables (*/tuˈkiedo/ > */huˈkiedo/).
-/r/ becomes /d/ (*/ʔaˈrendu/ > */ʔaˈdendu/).
-/ʔ/ is lost in unstressed syllables (*/ʔaˈdendu/ > */aˈdendu/).
-/h/ is lost in unstressed syllables (*/huˈkiedo/ > */uˈkiedo/).
-Pretonic vowels are lost (*/aˈdendu/ > /ˈdendu/, */uˈkiedo/ > /ˈkiedo/).

7:
(a) /ˈoʃila/
(b) /ˈlendu/
(c) /ˈtʃeedo/
(d) /ˈʃila/

-/Vl/ becomes /o/, via /Vɫ/, before a consonant (*/ˈkʷilkʷila/ > */ˈkʷokʷila/).
-/kʷ/ becomes /k/ before rounded vowels (*/ˈkʷokʷila/ > */ˈkokʷila/).
-/kʷ/ becomes /p/ (*/ˈkokʷila/ > */ˈkopila/, */ˈkʷila/ > */ˈpila/).
-/p/ becomes /h/, via /ɸ/ (*/ˈkopila/ > */ˈkohila/, */ˈpila/ > */ˈhila/).
-/k/ merges with /ʔ/ word-initially (*/ˈkohila/ > */ˈʔohila/).
-/t/ lenites to /h/ in initial unstressed syllables (*/tuˈkeedo/ > */huˈkeedo/).
-/h/ becomes /ʃ/, via /ç/, before /i/ (*/ˈʔohila/ > */ˈʔoʃila/, */ˈhila/ > /ˈʃila/).
-/k/ becomes /c/ before front vowels (*/huˈkeedo/ > */huˈceedo/).
-/r/ becomes /l/ (*/ʔaˈrendu/ > */ʔaˈlendu/).
-/ʔ/ is lost (*/ˈʔoʃila/ > /ˈoʃila/, */ʔaˈlendu/ > */aˈlendu/).
-/h/ is lost in unstressed syllables (*/huˈceedo/ > */uˈceedo/).
-/c/ becomes /tʃ/ (*/uˈceedo/ > */uˈtʃeedo/).
-Pretonic vowels are lost (*/aˈlendu/ > /ˈlendu/, */uˈtʃeedo/ > /ˈtʃeedo/).

8:
(a) /ˈeela/
(b) /ˈlendu/
(c) /ˈceedu/
(d) /ˈhila/

-/Vl/ becomes /o/, via /Vɫ/, before a consonant (*/ˈkʷilkʷila/ > */ˈkʷokʷila/).
-/kʷ/ becomes /k/ before rounded vowels (*/ˈkʷokʷila/ > */ˈkokʷila/).
-/kʷ/ becomes /p/ (*/ˈkokʷila/ > */ˈkopila/, */ˈkʷila/ > */ˈpila/).
-/p/ becomes /h/, via /ɸ/ (*/ˈkopila/ > */ˈkohila/, */ˈpila/ > /ˈhila/).
-/k/ merges with /ʔ/ word-initially (*/ˈkohila/ > */ˈʔohila/).
-/t/ lenites to /h/ in initial unstressed syllables (*/tuˈkeedo/ > */huˈkeedo/).
-/k/ becomes /c/ before front vowels (*/huˈkeedo/ > */huˈceedo/).
-/r/ becomes /l/ (*/ʔaˈrendu/ > */ʔaˈlendu/).
-/ʔ/ is lost (*/ˈʔohila/ > */ˈohila/, */ʔaˈlendu/ > */aˈlendu/).
-/h/ is lost in unstressed syllables (*/ˈohila/ > */ˈoila/, */huˈceedo/ > */uˈceedo/).
-Final /o/ becomes /u/ (*/uˈceedo/ > */uˈceedu/).
-/oi/ becomes /ee/ (*/ˈoila/ > /ˈeela/).
-Pretonic vowels are lost (*/aˈlendu/ > /ˈlendu/, */uˈceedu/ > /ˈceedu/).
Well since no-one else has attempted a reconstruction since the "re-attempt", I can say, Shimobaatar, that you were almost spot on, at least in regards to the proto-forms.

Image


The lines of direct descent are, as you might expect, vertical, running down from the proto-language to the descendent languages. The horizontal lines ( "<--->" ) mark instances of areal changes. For example, C and D both share the change *n > *0 syllable-finally, despite having split from the proto-language earlier.
You can tell the same lie a thousand times,
But it never gets any more true,
So close your eyes once more and once more believe
That they all still believe in you.
Just one time.

User avatar
sangi39
moderator
moderator
Posts: 3265
Joined: 12 Aug 2010 01:53
Location: North Yorkshire, UK

Re: Quick Diachronics Challenge

Post by sangi39 » 11 Aug 2019 20:19

ɶʙ ɞʛ wrote:
02 Aug 2019 19:35
Here's another one:

1- at’of, otsejes, inauf
2- at’ʊh, ɔtsʊiʃ, inauf
3- t’uf, tsu:ʃ, nɔ:f
4- aɗǝx, atsi:ç, inaux
5- at’uk, otsoits, inwok

6- at’ɨ:, tsø:ǝ, ino:.ɨ:
7- aɗɯ, dzoja, inawɯ
8- ali, zoe, ilau
9- anɨ, zoje, inowɨ
10- ats’i:, tʃe:a, inawi:

11- at’ɛθ, iʃoç, inauθ
12- t’ǝh, tsojǝh, nawǝh
13- ɗǝs, zoɉʝes, nab̪vos
14- lǝs, lodʒes, lavos
15- ɣɯ:, ɣoʒe:, ɣavo:
16- dıs, sɔdʒıs, nabʊs

17- tna, tʃʰaha, nwɔna
18- n̥a, ʃ:ehe, mon̥o
19- t’ah, s:jah, ⁿduǝh
20- atsa, os:ja:, ᵑɡwo:
Prelimary guess:
Spoiler:
at’ɯx, ǝtsoi(t)s, inawɯx
You can tell the same lie a thousand times,
But it never gets any more true,
So close your eyes once more and once more believe
That they all still believe in you.
Just one time.

User avatar
qwed117
mongolian
mongolian
Posts: 4444
Joined: 20 Nov 2014 02:27

Re: Quick Diachronics Challenge

Post by qwed117 » 11 Aug 2019 23:09

Hmm, I'm gonna go with
Spoiler:
*at'ək *tʲojəʲk *inabəʷk
and I'll think of an explanation later
Spoiler:
My minicity is Zyphrazia and Novland
What is made of man will crumble away.

shimobaatar
korean
korean
Posts: 11592
Joined: 12 Jul 2013 23:09
Location: PA → IN

Re: Quick Diachronics Challenge

Post by shimobaatar » 12 Aug 2019 02:16

sangi39 wrote:
11 Aug 2019 19:39
Well since no-one else has attempted a reconstruction since the "re-attempt", I can say, Shimobaatar, that you were almost spot on, at least in regards to the proto-forms.
Oh, wow, I did much better than I expected!

I was, at first, hoping to be able to go next, but I suppose that wouldn't really be fair since I was the only one who attempted after the fourth word was added, and in any case I see another round has already begun.

I've been working on this on and off throughout the day. I've assumed that the four groups separated out in the original post are four branches of the family, for convenience if nothing else. For each group, I started by making a list of shared changes, and then made lists of additional changes for each language within the group. The situation with this family is clearly more nuanced than what I was able to represent below, but I currently have neither the time nor the skills to do much better, I'm afraid.

"Proto-ABCD"
Spoiler:
*at'ǝc, *ɔtsojǝc, *inawn̥ǝc
"Group A"
1 - at'of, otsejes, inauf
2 - at'ʊh, ɔtsʊiʃ, inauf
3 - t'uf, tsuːʃ, nɔːf
4 - aɗǝx, atsiːç, inaux
5 - at'uk, otsoits, inwok
Spoiler:
Changes to Proto-A (*at'ǝk, *ɔtsojic, *inauk)
-/n̥/ is lost, possibly shifting to /h/ first. (*/inawn̥ǝc/ > */inawǝc/)
-/ǝ/ becomes /i/ after /j/ and /u/ after /w/. (*/ɔtsojǝc/ > */ɔtsojic/, */inawǝc/ > */inawuc/)
-/c/ shifts to /k/ word-finally after non-front vowels. (*/at'ǝc/ > */at'ǝk/, */inawuc/ > */inawuk/)
-/awu/ contracts to /au/. (*/inawuk/ > */inauk/)

Changes from Proto-A to 1 (at'of, otsejes, inauf)
-Final stops lenite to fricatives. (*/at'ǝk/ > */at'ǝx/, */ɔtsojic/ > */ɔtsojiç/, */inauk/ > */inaux/)
-/ǝ/ becomes /u/. (*/at'ǝx/ > */at'ux/)
-Following consonants, high vowels are lowered in final syllables. (*/at'ux/ > */at'ox/, */ɔtsojiç/ > */ɔtsojeç/)
-/o/ becomes /e/ before /j/. (*/ɔtsojeç/ > */ɔtsejeç/)
-/ɔ/ merges with /o/. (*/ɔtsejeç/ > */otsejeç/)
-/x/ becomes /f/ following rounded vowels. (*/at'ox/ > /at'of/, */inaux/ > /inauf/)
-/ç/ becomes /s/. (*/otsejeç/ > /otsejes/)

Changes from Proto-A to 2 (at'ʊh, ɔtsʊiʃ, inauf)
-Final stops lenite to fricatives. (*/at'ǝk/ > */at'ǝx/, */ɔtsojic/ > */ɔtsojiç/, */inauk/ > */inaux/)
-/oji/ contracts to /oi/. (*/ɔtsojiç/ > */ɔtsoiç/)
-/ǝ/ becomes /o/. (*/at'ǝx/ > */at'ox/)
-/x/ becomes /f/ following high rounded vowels. (*/inaux/ > /inauf/)
-/o/ becomes /ʊ/. (*/at'ox/ > */at'ʊx/, */ɔtsoiç/ > */ɔtsʊiç/)
-/x/ becomes /h/ (*/at'ʊx/ > /at'ʊh/)
-/ç/ becomes /ʃ/. (*/ɔtsʊiç/ > /ɔtsʊiʃ/)

Changes from Proto-A to 3 (t'uf, tsuːʃ, nɔːf)
-Final stops lenite to fricatives. (*/at'ǝk/ > */at'ǝx/, */ɔtsojic/ > */ɔtsojiç/, */inauk/ > */inaux/)
-Initial vowels are lost. (*/at'ǝx/ > */t'ǝx/, */ɔtsojiç/ > */tsojiç/, */inaux/ > */naux/)
-/oji/ contracts to /oi/. (*/tsojiç/ > */tsoiç/)
-/o/ and /ə/ merge as /u/. (*/t'ǝx/ > */t'ux/, */tsoiç/ > */tsuiç/)
-/x/ becomes /f/ following rounded vowels. (*/t'ux/ > /t'uf/, */naux/ > */nauf/)
-/ç/ becomes /ʃ/. (*/tsuiç/ > */tsuiʃ/)
-/au/ becomes /ɔː/. (*/nauf/ > /nɔːf/)
-/ui/ becomes /uː/. (*/tsuiʃ/ > /tsuːʃ/)

Changes from Proto-A to 4 (aɗǝx, atsiːç, inaux)
-Final stops lenite to fricatives. (*/at'ǝk/ > */at'ǝx/, */ɔtsojic/ > */ɔtsojiç/, */inauk/ > /inaux/)
-/ɔ/ merges with /a/. (*/ɔtsojiç/ > */atsojiç/)
-/oji/ contracts to /oi/. (*/atsojiç/ > */atsoiç/)
-/t'/ becomes /ɗ/. (*/at'ǝx/ > /aɗǝx/)
-/oi/ becomes /iː/. (*/atsoiç/ > /atsiːç/)

Changes from Proto-A to 5 (at'uk, otsoits, inwok)
-/oji/ contracts to /oi/. (*/ɔtsojic/ > */ɔtsoic/)
-/ɔ/ merges with /o/. (*/ɔtsoic/ > */otsoic/)
-/ə/ becomes /u/. (*/at'ǝk/ > /at'uk/)
-/au/ becomes /wo/, perhaps via /oː/. (*/inauk/ > /inwok/)
-/c/ merges with /ts/. (*/otsoic/ > /otsoits/)
"Group B"
6 - at'ɨː, tsøːǝ, inoː.ɨː
7 - aɗɯ, dzoja, inawɯ
8 - ali, zoe, ilau
9 - anɨ, zoje, inowɨ
10 - ats'iː, tʃeːa, inawiː
Spoiler:
Changes to Proto-B (*at'ǝx, *ətsoje, *inawǝx)
-/n̥/ is lost, possibly shifting to /h/ first. (*/inawn̥ǝc/ > */inawǝc/)
-/ɔ/ becomes /ə/ initially. (*/ɔtsojǝc/ > */ətsojǝc/)
-/ə/ becomes /e/ after /j/. (*/ətsojǝc/ > */ətsojec/)
-/c/ shifts to /k/ word-finally after non-front vowels. (*/at'ǝc/ > */at'ǝk/, */inawǝc/ > */inawǝk/)
-Final stops lenite to fricatives. (*/at'ǝk/ > */at'ǝx/, */ətsojec/ > */ətsojeç/, */inawǝk/ > /inawǝx/)
-/ç/ is lost. (*/ətsojeç/ > */ətsoje/)

Changes from Proto-B to 6 (at'ɨː, tsøːǝ, inoː.ɨː)
-/x/ is lost word-finally, lengthening preceding /ǝ/ to /ɨː/. (*/at'ǝx/ > /at'ɨː/, */inawǝx/ > */inawɨː/)
-/ǝ/ is lost initially. (*/ətsoje/ > */tsoje/)
-/oj/ becomes /øː/. (*/tsoje/ > */tsøːe/)
-/aw/ becomes /oː/. (*/inawɨː/ > /inoː.ɨː/)
-/e/ becomes /ǝ/ word-finally. (*/tsøːe/ > /tsøːǝ/)

Changes from Proto-B to 7 (aɗɯ, dzoja, inawɯ)
-/x/ is lost word-finally, lengthening preceding /ǝ/ to /ɯː/. (*/at'ǝx/ > */at'ɯː/, */inawǝx/ > */inawɯː/)
-Intervocalic voicing occurs, with ejectives becoming implosives. (*/at'ɯː/ > */aɗɯː/, */ətsoje/ > */ədzoje/)
-/ǝ/ is lost initially. (*/ədzoje/ > */dzoje/)
-Vowels are shortened word-finally. (*/aɗɯː/ > /aɗɯ/, */inawɯː/ > /inawɯ/)
-Final /e/ shifts to /a/. (*/dzoje/ > /dzoja/)

Changes from Proto-B to 8 (ali, zoe, ilau)
-Intervocalic voicing occurs, with ejectives becoming implosives. (*/at'ǝx/ > */aɗǝx/, */ətsoje/ > */ədzoje/)
-/awǝ/ becomes /au/. (*/inawǝx/ > */inaux/)
-/ǝ/ is lost initially. (*/ədzoje/ > */dzoje/)
-/x/ is lost word-finally, lengthening preceding /ǝ/ and /au/ to /iː/ and /aːu/. (*/aɗǝx/ > */aɗiː/, */inaux/ > */inaːu/)
-Vowels are shortened word-finally. (*/aɗiː/ > */aɗi/, */inaːu/ > */inau/)
-/j/ is lost intervocalically. (*/dzoje/ > */dzoe/)
-/ɗ/ shifts to /n/. (*/aɗi/ > */ani/)
-/dz/ becomes /z/. (*/dzoe/ > /zoe/)
-/n/ shifts to /l/. (*/ani/ > /ali/, */inau/ > /ilau/)

Changes from Proto-B to 9 (anɨ, zoje, inowɨ)
-Intervocalic voicing occurs, with ejectives becoming implosives. (*/at'ǝx/ > */aɗǝx/, */ətsoje/ > */ədzoje/)
-/ǝ/ is lost initially. (*/ədzoje/ > */dzoje/)
-/x/ is lost word-finally, lengthening preceding /ǝ/ to /ɨː/. (*/aɗǝx/ > */aɗɨː/, */inawǝx/ > */inawɨː/)
-Vowels are shortened word-finally. (*/aɗɨː/ > */aɗɨ/, */inawɨː/ > */inawɨ/)
-/ɗ/ shifts to /n/. (*/aɗɨ/ > /anɨ/)
-/dz/ becomes /z/. (*/dzoje/ > /zoje/)
-/a/ becomes /o/ before /w/. (*/inawɨ/ > /inowɨ/)

Changes from Proto-B to 10 (ats'iː, tʃeːa, inawiː)
-/ǝ/ is lost initially. (*/ətsoje/ > */tsoje/)
-/x/ is lost word-finally, lengthening preceding /ǝ/ to /iː/. (*/at'ǝx/ > */at'iː/, */inawǝx/ > /inawiː/)
-Final /e/ shifts to /a/. (*/tsoje/ > */tsoja/)
-/oj/ becomes /eː/, possibly via /øː/. (*/tsoja/ > */tseːa/)
-/t'/ and /ts/ are palatalized to /ts'/ and /tʃ/, respectively, before front vowels. (*/at'iː/ > /ats'iː/, */tseːa/ > /tʃeːa/)
"Group C"
11 - at'ɛθ, iʃoç, inauθ
12 - t'ǝh, tsojǝh, nawǝh
13 - ɗǝs, zoɟʝes, nab̪vos
14 - lǝs, lodʒes, lavos
15 - ɣɯː, ɣoʒeː, ɣavoː
16 - dɪs, sɔdʒɪs, nabʊs
Spoiler:
Changes to Proto-C (*at'əθ, *icojəθ, *inawəθ)
-/n̥/ is lost, possibly shifting to /h/ first. (*/inawn̥ǝc/ > */inawǝc/)
-/ɔ/ becomes /ə/ initially. (*/ɔtsojǝc/ > */ətsojǝc/)
-Initial /ə/ merges with /i/. (*/ətsojǝc/ > */itsojǝc/)
-/c/ shifts to /θ/. (*/at'ǝc/ > */at'ǝθ/, */itsojǝc/ > */itsojǝθ/, */inawǝc/ > */inawǝθ/)

Changes from Proto-C to 11 (at'ɛθ, iʃoç, inauθ)
-/ts/ becomes /s/. (*/itsojəθ/ > */isojəθ/)
-/s/ is palatalized to /ʃ/ after /i/. (*/isojəθ/ > */iʃojəθ/)
-/ojə/ becomes /oi/. (*/iʃojəθ/ > */iʃoiθ/)
-/awə/ becomes /au/. (*/inawəθ/ > /inauθ/)
-/iθ/ becomes /ç/ word-finally. (*/iʃoiθ/ > /iʃoç/)
-/ə/ becomes /ɛ/. (*/at'əθ/ > /at'ɛθ/)

Changes from Proto-C to 12 (t'ǝh, tsojǝh, nawǝh)
-Vowels are lost word-initially. (*/at'əθ/ > */t'əθ/, */itsojəθ/ > */tsojəθ/, */inawəθ/ > */nawəθ/)
-/θ/ becomes /h/. (*/t'əθ/ > /t'əh/, */tsojəθ/ > /tsojəh/, */nawəθ/ > /nawəh/)

Changes from Proto-C to 13 (ɗǝs, zoɟʝes, nab̪vos)
-/ts/ becomes /s/. (*/itsojəθ/ > */isojəθ/)
-Intervocalic voicing occurs, with ejectives becoming implosives. (*/at'əθ/ > */aɗəθ/, */isojəθ/ > */izojəθ/)
-/ə/ becomes /e/ after /j/ and /o/ after /w/. (*/izojəθ/ > */izojeθ/, */inawəθ/ > */inawoθ/)
-Intervocalic /j/ and /w/ become /ɟʝ/ and /b̪v/, respectively. (*/izojeθ/ > */izoɟʝeθ/, */inawoθ/ > */inab̪voθ/)
-Vowels are lost word-initially. (*/aɗəθ/ > */ɗəθ/, */izoɟʝeθ/ > */zoɟʝeθ/, */inawəθ/ > */nab̪voθ/)
-/θ/ becomes /s/. (*/ɗəθ/ > /ɗəs/, */zoɟʝeθ/ > /zoɟʝes/, */nab̪voθ/ > /nab̪vos/)

Changes from Proto-C to 14 (lǝs, lodʒes, lavos)
-/ts/ becomes /s/. (*/itsojəθ/ > */isojəθ/)
-Intervocalic voicing occurs, with ejectives becoming implosives. (*/at'əθ/ > */aɗəθ/, */isojəθ/ > */izojəθ/)
-/ə/ becomes /e/ after /j/ and /o/ after /w/. (*/izojəθ/ > */izojeθ/, */inawəθ/ > */inawoθ/)
-Intervocalic /j/ and /w/ become /dʒ/ and /v/, respectively. (*/izojeθ/ > */izodʒeθ/, */inawoθ/ > */inavoθ/)
-Vowels are lost word-initially. (*/aɗəθ/ > */ɗəθ/, */izodʒeθ/ > */zodʒeθ/, */inavoθ/ > */navoθ/)
-/θ/ becomes /s/. (*/ɗəθ/ > */ɗəs/, */zodʒeθ/ > */zodʒes/, */navoθ/ > */navos/)
-/ɗ/, /z/, and /n/ merge as /l/. (*/ɗəs/ > /ləs/, */zodʒes/ > /lodʒes/, */navos/ > /lavos/)

Changes from Proto-C to 15 (ɣɯː, ɣoʒeː, ɣavoː)
-/ts/ becomes /s/. (*/itsojəθ/ > */isojəθ/)
-Intervocalic voicing occurs, with ejectives becoming implosives. (*/at'əθ/ > */aɗəθ/, */isojəθ/ > */izojəθ/)
-/ə/ becomes /e/ after /j/ and /o/ after /w/. (*/izojəθ/ > */izojeθ/, */inawəθ/ > */inawoθ/)
-Intervocalic /j/ and /w/ become /ʒ/ and /v/, respectively. (*/izojeθ/ > */izoʒeθ/, */inawoθ/ > */inavoθ/)
-Vowels are lost word-initially. (*/aɗəθ/ > */ɗəθ/, */izoʒeθ/ > */zoʒeθ/, */inavoθ/ > */navoθ/)
-/θ/ is lost, lengthening /ə/, /e/, and /o/ to /ɯː/, /eː/, and /oː/. (*/ɗəθ/ > */ɗɯː/, */zoʒeθ/ > */zoʒeː/, */navoθ/ > */navoː/)
-/ɗ/, /z/, and /n/ merge as /ɣ/, perhaps via /ɫ/. (*/ɗɯː/ > /ɣɯː/, */zoʒeː/ > /ɣoʒeː/, */navoː/ > /ɣavoː/)

Changes from Proto-C to 16 (dɪs, sɔdʒɪs, nabʊs)
-/ts/ becomes /s/. (*/itsojəθ/ > */isojəθ/)
-/i/ is lost word-initially. (*/isojəθ/ > */sojəθ/, */inawəθ/ > */nawəθ/)
-Intervocalic voicing occurs, with ejectives becoming implosives. (*/at'əθ/ > */aɗəθ/)
-Ejectives become plain voiced stops. (*/aɗəθ/ > */adəθ/)
-Initial /a/ is lost. (*/adəθ/ > */dəθ/)
-Intervocalic /j/ and /w/ become /dʒ/ and /b/, respectively. (*/sojəθ/ > */sodʒəθ/, */nawəθ/ > */nabəθ/)
-/θ/ becomes /s/. (*/dəθ/ > */dəs/, */sodʒəθ/ > */sodʒəs/, */nabəθ/ > */nabəs/)
-/o/ becomes /ɔ/. (*/sodʒəs/ > */sɔdʒəs/)
-/ə/ becomes /ʊ/ after labials and /ɪ/ elsewhere. (*/dəs/ > /dɪs/, */sɔdʒəs/ > /sɔdʒɪs/, */nabəs/ > /nabʊs/)
"Group D"
17 - tna, tʃʰaha, nwɔna
18 - n̥a, ʃːehe, mon̥o
19 - t'ah, sːjah, ⁿduǝh
20 - atsa, osːjaː, ᵑɡwoː
Spoiler:
Changes to Proto-D (*at'ah, *otsehah, *inoːn̥ah)
-/c/ lenites to /h/ word-finally. (*/at'ǝc/ > */at'ǝh/, */ɔtsojǝc/ > */ɔtsojǝh/, */inawn̥ǝc/ > */inawn̥ǝh/)
-/ɔ/ merges with /o/. (*/ɔtsojǝh/ > */otsojǝh/)
-Non-high vowels become /e/ before /j/ and /o/ before /w/. (*/otsojǝh/ > */otsejǝh/, */inawn̥ǝh/ > */inown̥ǝh/)
-/ǝ/ merges with /a/. (*/at'ǝh/ > */at'ah/, */otsejǝh/ > */otsejah/, */inown̥ǝh/ > */inown̥ah/)
-/j/ becomes /h/. (*/otsejah/ > */otsehah/)
-/ow/ becomes /oː/. (*/inown̥ah/ > */inoːn̥ah/)

Changes from Proto-D to 17 (tna, tʃʰaha, nwɔna)
-Final /h/ is lost. (*/at'ah/ > */at'a/, */otsehah/ > */otseha/, */inoːn̥ah/ > */inoːn̥a/)
-Medial /e/ and /oː/ diphthongize to /ja/ and /wɔ/, respectively. (*/otseha/ > */otsjaha/, */inoːn̥a/ > */inwɔn̥a/)
-/t'/ becomes /tn/. (*/at'a/ > */atna/)
-Vowels are lost word-initially. (*/atna/ > /tna/, */otsjaha/ > */tsjaha/, */inwɔn̥a/ > */nwɔn̥a/)
-/tsj/ becomes /tʃʰ/ initially. (*/tsjaha/ > /tʃʰaha/)
-Intervocalic voicing occurs. (*/nwɔn̥a/ > /nwɔna/)

Changes from Proto-D to 18 (n̥a, ʃːehe, mon̥o)
-Final /h/ is lost. (*/at'ah/ > */at'a/, */otsehah/ > */otseha/, */inoːn̥ah/ > */inoːn̥a/)
-Medial /e/ and /oː/ diphthongize to /je/ and /wo/, respectively. (*/otseha/ > */otsjeha/, */inoːn̥a/ > */inwon̥a/)
-/t'/ becomes /tn/. (*/at'a/ > */atna/)
-/tsj/ becomes /ʃː/. (*/otsjeha/ > */oʃːeha/)
-Vowels are lost word-initially. (*/atna/ > */tna/, */oʃːeha/ > */ʃːeha/, */inwon̥a/ > */nwon̥a/)
-Initial /tn/ becomes /n̥/. (*/tna/ > /n̥a/)
-/nw/ becomes /m/. (*/nwon̥a/ > */mon̥a/)
-/a/ fully assimilates to the vowel of a preceding syllable. (*/ʃːeha/ > /ʃːehe/, */mon̥a/ > /mon̥o/)

Changes from Proto-D to 19 (t'ah, sːjah, ⁿduǝh)
-Medial /e/ and /oː/ diphthongize to /ja/ and /uǝ/, respectively. (*/otsehah/ > */otsjahah/, */inoːn̥ah/ > */inuǝn̥ah/)
-/ts/ becomes /sː/. (*/otsjahah/ > */osːjahah/)
-/n̥/ merges with /h/. (*/inuǝn̥ah/ > */inuǝhah/)
-Vowels are lost word-initially. (*/at'ah/ > /t'ah/, */osːjahah/ > */sːjahah/, */inuǝhah/ > */nuǝhah/)
-/n/ becomes /ⁿd/ initially. (*/nuǝhah/ > */ⁿduǝhah/)
-Final syllables are lost. (*/sːjahah/ > /sːjah/, */ⁿduǝhah/ > /ⁿduǝh/)

Changes from Proto-D to 20 (atsa, osːjaː, ᵑɡwoː)
-Final /h/ is lost. (*/at'ah/ > */at'a/, */otsehah/ > */otseha/, */inoːn̥ah/ > */inoːn̥a/)
-Medial /e/ and /oː/ diphthongize to /ja/ and /wo/, respectively. (*/otsehah/ > */otsjahah/, */inoːn̥ah/ > */inwon̥ah/)
-/ts/ becomes /sː/. (*/otsjahah/ > */osːjahah/)
-/n̥/ merges with /h/. (*/inwon̥ah/ > */inwohah/)
-/t'/ becomes /ts/. (*/at'ah/ > */atsah/)
-High vowels are lost word-initially. (*/inwohah/ > */nwohah/)
-/n/ becomes /ᵑɡ/ initially before /w/. (*/nwohah/ > */ᵑɡwohah/)
-/h/ is lost, and resulting sequences of vowels coalesce. (*/atsah/ > /atsa/, */osːjahah/ > /osːjaː/, */ᵑɡwohah/ > /ᵑɡwoː/)

ɶʙ ɞʛ
cuneiform
cuneiform
Posts: 77
Joined: 02 Aug 2019 18:47

Re: Quick Diachronics Challenge

Post by ɶʙ ɞʛ » 12 Aug 2019 02:59

*t' is correct in the first word.

Shimobaatar:

The Proto-B is very close. You may be forgetting about the possible formation of θ in proto-C.
Group A: The word-final /f/ was caused by labialization due to a rounded vowel.
Group B: The loss of what you assumed was /x/ happened early in Proto-B.
There is an /n̥/ at one point in the development of group C, but not where you assumed.
C > 13: /dʒ ɟʝ/ and /v b̪v/ did come from /j/ and /w/ at one point.
There are many cases of lenition like /ts/ > /s/, but there is also one case of /s/ > /ts/ in group A.
/tn/ in D is not rhinoglottophilia (i.e. /t' > tʔ > tn/)

Proto-language inventory:

/m n/
/p t k/
/b d/
/f s z ɣ/
/j w/

/a e i o u/

Clarification: /pp tt kk/ are realized as ejective, so that *t' is correct in the protolanguage.
Last edited by ɶʙ ɞʛ on 13 Aug 2019 23:28, edited 2 times in total.

User avatar
qwed117
mongolian
mongolian
Posts: 4444
Joined: 20 Nov 2014 02:27

Re: Quick Diachronics Challenge

Post by qwed117 » 12 Aug 2019 05:14

that's the proto-language inventory? Now you've stumped me
Spoiler:
My minicity is Zyphrazia and Novland
What is made of man will crumble away.

ɶʙ ɞʛ
cuneiform
cuneiform
Posts: 77
Joined: 02 Aug 2019 18:47

Re: Quick Diachronics Challenge

Post by ɶʙ ɞʛ » 23 Aug 2019 04:50

Is anyone still here? Would anyone like another hint?

shimobaatar
korean
korean
Posts: 11592
Joined: 12 Jul 2013 23:09
Location: PA → IN

Re: Quick Diachronics Challenge

Post by shimobaatar » 01 Sep 2019 05:05

I'd like to give it another go at some point, but since sangi39 and qwed117 seemed to indicate that they were planning to at least expand on their original responses:
sangi39 wrote:
11 Aug 2019 20:19
Prelimary guess:
qwed117 wrote:
11 Aug 2019 23:09
and I'll think of an explanation later
I've been waiting/holding back in order to give them, or anyone else who might like to jump in, a chance to do so.

User avatar
sangi39
moderator
moderator
Posts: 3265
Joined: 12 Aug 2010 01:53
Location: North Yorkshire, UK

Re: Quick Diachronics Challenge

Post by sangi39 » 01 Sep 2019 13:41

shimobaatar wrote:
01 Sep 2019 05:05
I'd like to give it another go at some point, but since sangi39 and qwed117 seemed to indicate that they were planning to at least expand on their original responses:
sangi39 wrote:
11 Aug 2019 20:19
Prelimary guess:
qwed117 wrote:
11 Aug 2019 23:09
and I'll think of an explanation later
I've been waiting/holding back in order to give them, or anyone else who might like to jump in, a chance to do so.
I've been busy the last couple of weeks with reptiles and larp stuff, so I honestly haven't had time to give this even a cursory glance recently.
You can tell the same lie a thousand times,
But it never gets any more true,
So close your eyes once more and once more believe
That they all still believe in you.
Just one time.

User avatar
qwed117
mongolian
mongolian
Posts: 4444
Joined: 20 Nov 2014 02:27

Re: Quick Diachronics Challenge

Post by qwed117 » 03 Sep 2019 06:16

I'm only on here very sporadically so don't feel bound out of some observance to me
Spoiler:
My minicity is Zyphrazia and Novland
What is made of man will crumble away.

Post Reply