British Romance Language Collablang

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Re: British Romance Language Collablang

Post by gokupwned5 » 01 Dec 2018 18:29

90. A
91. C
92. B
93. A

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Re: British Romance Language Collablang

Post by gokupwned5 » 02 Dec 2018 03:47

The results are in!

-

90) How should the nasals /m n ɲ/ be written?
a) /m n ɲ/ - <m n gn~ni> (The alternation for /ɲ/ is based on etymological differences)

91) How should the vowels /i u e ə o a/ be written?
c) /i u e ə o a/ - <i~y u e e~a o a> (The alternations for /ə/ and /i/ are based on etymological differences)

92) Should Middle Brettaniot verbs maintain a distinction between the indicative and subjunctive moods.
b) No.

93) Guilliam I dies in 1110 CE. Stephen I is now 19 years old and ready to rule Britain. Who should he marry?
a) Matilda of Boulogne - Since Matilda is descended from the Pre-Norman Kings of Lyndein, this would increase Stephen's legitimacy, as well as that of any heirs he produces.

-

94) How should /k g/ be written?
a) /k g/ - <c g> (<qu gu> before front vowels)
b) /k g/ - <c g> (<k gu> before front vowels)
c) /k g/ - <c g> (<k gh> before front vowels)
d) /k g/ - <c g> (<k g> before front vowels)
e) Other.

95) What should be the fate of /t͡s d͡z/?
a) They should be retained.
b) /t͡s d͡z/ > /s z/
c) Other.

96) What should be the fate of /t͡ʃ d͡ʒ/?
a) They should be retained.
b) /t͡ʃ d͡ʒ/ > /ʃ ʒ/
c) Other.

97) How should /r l ʎ j w/ be written?
a) /r l ʎ j w/ - <r l li i u>
b) /r l ʎ j w/ - <r l ly y~i w~u> (<y w> and <i u> are interchangeable, but <i u> are never found as semivowels word-initially and between vowels)
c) /r l ʎ j w/ - <r l gl~li y~i w~u> (the spelling of /ʎ/ is determined etymologically, and /j w/ <i u> except initially, finally, and between vowels) - proposed by shimobaatar
d) /r l ʎ j w/ - < r l ļ i~y ŭ>(<y> and <i> are interchangeable, but <i> is never found as semivowels word-initially and between vowels) - proposed by samsam
e) Other.

-

These are the sound changes that have happened so far from Vulgar Latin to Middle Brettaniot.
Spoiler:
Vulgar Latin to Proto-Brettaniot
/ɪ ʊ/ > /i o/
/skʲ/ > /ʃ/
/kkʲ kʲ gʲ/ > /t͡ʃ t͡ʃ j~d͡ʒ/
/Cs Ct/ > /jʃ jt͡ʃ/
/tʲ dʲ/ > /t͡s d͡z/
/i u e o ɛ ɔ a/ > /i u ei ou iə uə æ~iə/ | in open syllables
/p b t d k g/ > /b v d ð g ɣ/ | between vowels
/i u e o ɛ ɔ a/ > /i u ə o ə o ə/ | unstressed
/u o ou ɔ/ > /y u u o/
/j/ > /d͡ʒ/ | word-initially
/jj/ > /d͡ʒ/ | in medial position
/mn kn gn nj/ > /ɲ/
/pl tl kl gl lj/ > /ʎ/
/t d/ > /θ ð/ /_#
Proto-Brettaniot to Old Brettaniot
/ɣ/ > /j/ | after front vowels
/ɣ/ > /w/
/y/ > /i/
/i u/ > /ɪ ʊ/ | unstressed
/iə uə/ > /ɪ ʊ/
/ij uj ɪj ʊj ej oj ɛj aj/ > /i ui ei oi ei oi ei ai/
/iw uw ɪw ʊw ew ow ɛw aw/ > /iu u eu ou eu ou eu au/
/ɪ ʊ/ > /e o/
The phoneme /h/ entered Old Brettaniot through loanwords.
/ə/ > /Ø/ | word-finally
/f θ s/ > /v ð z/ | between vowels
/ui iu/ > /y/
Old Brettaniot to Middle Brettaniot
/y/ > /i/
/ɲ ʎ/ > /ɲ ʎ/, /jɲ~jn jʎ~jl/ after vowels
/ɛ/ > /ea/
/θ ð/ > /d/
/oi eu ei ou ea/ > /we jo je wo ja/
And here's the current phonology of Middle Brettaniot.
Spoiler:
/m n ɲ/ - <m n gn~ni>
/p b t d k g/ - <p b t d ? ?>
/t͡s d͡z t͡ʃ d͡ʒ/ - <>
/f v s z ʃ/ - <>
/r l ʎ j w/ - <>
/i u e ə o a/ - <i~y u e e~a o a>
/ai au/ - <>
Voting closes next Saturday at 21:00 EDT, or next Sunday at 01:00 UTC. Results will be posted around 30 minutes after that.
Last edited by gokupwned5 on 02 Dec 2018 14:10, edited 3 times in total.

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Re: British Romance Language Collablang

Post by shimobaatar » 02 Dec 2018 04:57

94: b c
95: a
96: a
97: c (/r l ʎ j w/ <r l gl~li y~i w~u> (the spelling of /ʎ/ is determined etymologically, and /j w/ <i u> except initially, finally, and between vowels))

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Re: British Romance Language Collablang

Post by this_is_an_account » 02 Dec 2018 07:02

94: A
95: A
96: A
97: C - shimobaatar's suggestion

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Re: British Romance Language Collablang

Post by samsam » 02 Dec 2018 09:31

94: A
95:
96: A
97: C /r l ʎ j w/ - < r l ļ i~y ŭ>(<y> and <i> are interchangeable, but <i> is never found as semivowels word-initially and between vowels)
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Re: British Romance Language Collablang

Post by Jackk » 02 Dec 2018 18:21

94 a
95 a
96 b
97 c
Eresse anga paris cur neduc, a san teonga.
The only thing more dangerous than doubt is certainty.

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Re: British Romance Language Collablang

Post by gokupwned5 » 09 Dec 2018 00:56

94. C
95. B
96. A
97. B

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Re: British Romance Language Collablang

Post by gokupwned5 » 09 Dec 2018 03:33

The results are in!

-

94) How should /k g/ be written?
a) /k g/ - <c g> (<qu gu> before front vowels)

95) What should be the fate of /t͡s d͡z/?
a) They should be retained.

96) What should be the fate of /t͡ʃ d͡ʒ/?
a) They should be retained.

97) How should /r l ʎ j w/ be written?
c) /r l ʎ j w/ - <r l gl~li y~i w~u> (the spelling of /ʎ/ is determined etymologically, and /j w/ <i u> except initially, finally, and between vowels) - proposed by shimobaatar -

-

98) How should /t͡s d͡z/ be written?
a) /t͡s d͡z/ - <ç z>
b) /t͡s d͡z/ - <z dz>
c) /t͡s d͡z/ - <ts dz>
d) Other.

99) How should /t͡ʃ d͡ʒ/ be written?
a) /t͡ʃ d͡ʒ/ - <ch~c j~g>
b) /t͡ʃ d͡ʒ/ - <ci~c gi~g>
c) Other.

100) How should /f v s z ʃ/ be written?
a) /f v s z ʃ/ - <f v s~ss s sh~sc> (/ʃ/ would be <sc> before front vowels)
b) /f v s z ʃ/ - <f v s~ss s sh>
c) /f v s z ʃ/ - <ff f s~ss s sh>
d) /f v s z ʃ/ - <f~ff f s~ss s sci~sc> (/f s/ would be <f s> word-initially and adjacent to a consonant, and <ff ss> intervocalically. /ʃ/ would be <sci> before back vowels and <sc> before front vowels, i.e. the same orthographic alternation as with /tʃ/ <ci~c> in 99b.) - proposed by cedh
e) Other.

101) Previously, Stephen I had named his son Eustace as heir to the Brettaniot throne. Unfortunately, Eustace died in 1153 CE, while Stephen I was still king. Who should Stephen I name as his heir now, to avoid another dispute?
a) Guilliam - the second son of Stephen I
b) Enri, Count of Champagne - the nephew of Stephen I (also of the House of Blois)
c) Other.

-

These are the sound changes that have happened so far from Vulgar Latin to Middle Brettaniot.
Spoiler:
Vulgar Latin to Proto-Brettaniot
/ɪ ʊ/ > /i o/
/skʲ/ > /ʃ/
/kkʲ kʲ gʲ/ > /t͡ʃ t͡ʃ j~d͡ʒ/
/Cs Ct/ > /jʃ jt͡ʃ/
/tʲ dʲ/ > /t͡s d͡z/
/i u e o ɛ ɔ a/ > /i u ei ou iə uə æ~iə/ | in open syllables
/p b t d k g/ > /b v d ð g ɣ/ | between vowels
/i u e o ɛ ɔ a/ > /i u ə o ə o ə/ | unstressed
/u o ou ɔ/ > /y u u o/
/j/ > /d͡ʒ/ | word-initially
/jj/ > /d͡ʒ/ | in medial position
/mn kn gn nj/ > /ɲ/
/pl tl kl gl lj/ > /ʎ/
/t d/ > /θ ð/ /_#
Proto-Brettaniot to Old Brettaniot
/ɣ/ > /j/ | after front vowels
/ɣ/ > /w/
/y/ > /i/
/i u/ > /ɪ ʊ/ | unstressed
/iə uə/ > /ɪ ʊ/
/ij uj ɪj ʊj ej oj ɛj aj/ > /i ui ei oi ei oi ei ai/
/iw uw ɪw ʊw ew ow ɛw aw/ > /iu u eu ou eu ou eu au/
/ɪ ʊ/ > /e o/
The phoneme /h/ entered Old Brettaniot through loanwords.
/ə/ > /Ø/ | word-finally
/f θ s/ > /v ð z/ | between vowels
/ui iu/ > /y/
Old Brettaniot to Middle Brettaniot
/y/ > /i/
/ɲ ʎ/ > /ɲ ʎ/, /jɲ~jn jʎ~jl/ after vowels
/ɛ/ > /ea/
/θ ð/ > /d/
/oi eu ei ou ea/ > /we jo je wo ja/
And here's the current phonology of Middle Brettaniot.
Spoiler:
/m n ɲ/ - <m n gn~ni>
/p b t d k g/ - <p b t d c~qu g~gu>
/t͡s d͡z t͡ʃ d͡ʒ/ - <>
/f v s z ʃ/ - <>
/r l ʎ j w/ - <r l gl~li y~i w~u>
/i u e ə o a/ - <i~y u e e~a o a>
/ai au/ - <>
Voting closes next Saturday at 21:00 EDT, or next Sunday at 01:00 UTC. Results will be posted around 30 minutes after that.
Last edited by gokupwned5 on 09 Dec 2018 14:58, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: British Romance Language Collablang

Post by this_is_an_account » 09 Dec 2018 04:34

98: B
99: B
100: A
101: A
Last edited by this_is_an_account on 09 Dec 2018 08:14, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: British Romance Language Collablang

Post by shimobaatar » 09 Dec 2018 06:24

98: b
99: b
100: a
101: a

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Re: British Romance Language Collablang

Post by cedh » 09 Dec 2018 10:29

98: a
99: b
100: d: /f v s z ʃ/ - <f~ff f s~ss s sci~sc> (/f s/ would be <f s> word-initially and adjacent to a consonant, and <ff ss> intervocalically. /ʃ/ would be <sci> before back vowels and <sc> before front vowels, i.e. the same orthographic alternation as with /tʃ/ <ci~c> in 99b.)
101: b

Can we see a small sample of the language at this stage, for instance the declension pattern of one or two common nouns, the conjugation pattern of one or two common verbs, and maybe a simple sentence too?

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Re: British Romance Language Collablang

Post by gokupwned5 » 09 Dec 2018 14:58

cedh wrote:
09 Dec 2018 10:29
Can we see a small sample of the language at this stage, for instance the declension pattern of one or two common nouns, the conjugation pattern of one or two common verbs, and maybe a simple sentence too?
Sure, I'll put one up in a little while.

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Re: British Romance Language Collablang

Post by gokupwned5 » 09 Dec 2018 17:31

Since we've yet to vote on how affricates, fricatives, and diphthongs will be written, the following examples will be shown with an IPA transcription, and an orthography based on everything we've voted on for Middle Brettaniot, as well as how the fricatives, affricates, and the remaining diphthongs were written in Old Brettaniot. Those are only being used for demonstrative purposes.

Nostre pader que est en cel, que tu nome est santificade.
/nostrə padər kə est en t͡ʃel kə tu nomə est santifikadə/
Our Father who art in heaven, hallowed be thy name.

Conjugation of passar "to pass" (this is only one conjugation, the other two are e-stem verbs and i-stem verbs)
Spoiler:
Present
je passe
ti passas
ill/illa passat
nus passans
vus passais
ills/illas passant

Past
je passave
ti passavest
ill/illa passavet
passavens
passaustes (this came from a mixture of -aveis and -astes, the imperfect and preterite endings for the second person plural pronouns)
passavent

Future
je passarai
ti passaras
ill/illa passarat
nus passarains
vus passarais
ills/illas passaraint

Conditional
je passare
ti passares
ill/illa passaret
nus passarens
vus passaris
ills/illas passarent

Imperative
tu pass
vus passad

Present Participle
passande

Past Participle
Masc. Sing.: passade
Fem. Sing.: passada
Masc. Plu.: passades
Fem. Plu.: passadas
EDIT: While making these examples, I saw a problem. Should the sound change /oi eu ei ou ea/ > /we jo je wo ja/ not apply in certain positions? It results in words like /lje/ for law and /rjanə/ for frog if we don't.

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Re: British Romance Language Collablang

Post by samsam » 09 Dec 2018 19:37

gokupwned5 wrote:
09 Dec 2018 17:31
EDIT: While making these examples, I saw a problem. Should the sound change /oi eu ei ou ea/ > /we jo je wo ja/ not apply in certain positions? It results in words like /lje/ for law and /rjanə/ for frog if we don't.
Yes, I agree.
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Re: British Romance Language Collablang

Post by gokupwned5 » 09 Dec 2018 20:09

samsam wrote:
09 Dec 2018 19:37
gokupwned5 wrote:
09 Dec 2018 17:31
EDIT: While making these examples, I saw a problem. Should the sound change /oi eu ei ou ea/ > /we jo je wo ja/ not apply in certain positions? It results in words like /lje/ for law and /rjanə/ for frog if we don't.
Yes, I agree.
Okay. I'll make it so it doesn't apply after word-initial consonants or after consonant clusters (really the only cases where it would be a problem). In that case, the words mentioned above would now be /lei/ law and /reanə/ for frog. Now we just need to vote again on what should happen to /ea/ in this position, but I'll incorporate that into the next round of questions.

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Re: British Romance Language Collablang

Post by shimobaatar » 09 Dec 2018 20:19

Oh, I don't mind words like /lje/ and /rjanə/, personally.

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Re: British Romance Language Collablang

Post by Birdlang » 09 Dec 2018 20:31

98) A
99) A
100) D
101) A
Ꭓꭓ Ʝʝ Ɬɬ Ɦɦ Ɡɡ Ɥɥ Ɫɫ Ɽɽ Ɑɑ Ɱɱ Ɐɐ Ɒɒ Ɓɓ Ɔɔ Ɖɖ Ɗɗ Əə Ɛɛ Ɠɠ Ɣɣ Ɯɯ Ɲɲ Ɵɵ Ʀʀ Ʃʃ Ʈʈ Ʊʊ Ʋʋ Ʒʒ Ꞵꞵ Ʉʉ Ʌʌ Ŋŋ Ɂɂ Ɪɪ Ææ Øø Ð𠌜 Ɜɜ Ǝɘ

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Re: British Romance Language Collablang

Post by gokupwned5 » 09 Dec 2018 21:08

shimobaatar wrote:
09 Dec 2018 20:19
Oh, I don't mind words like /lje/ and /rjanə/, personally.
Yeah. Maybe we could vote on whether or not we should change the rules surrounding that sound change? I could include it in next week's questions.

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Re: British Romance Language Collablang

Post by samsam » 09 Dec 2018 21:42

98) A
99) A
100) A
101) B
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Re: British Romance Language Collablang

Post by gokupwned5 » 16 Dec 2018 03:25

98. A
99. B
100. A
101. B

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