Lapdeutsch

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All4Ɇn
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Re: Lapdeutsch

Post by All4Ɇn » 24 Mar 2019 14:18

Numerals

Cardinal
As discussed earlier, éin, twei, drei, and vier all have their own patterns for declension
1: Éin (Éine)
2: Twei (Twein/Two)
3: Drei
4: Vier
5: Feif
6: Sechs
7: Seven
8: Acht
9: Neun
10: Tein
11: Elf
12: Twälf
13: Dritten
14: Veurten
15: Feiften
16: Sechsten
17: Seventen
18: Achtten
19: Neunten
20: Twentig
30: Dreitig
40: Veurtig
50: Feiftig
60: Sechstig
70: Seventig
80: Achttig
90: Neuntig
100: Hunderd
1000: Düsend
1.000.000: Million /mɪˈljoːn/

Counting 1 & 2
When counting, such as on one's fingers, the numbers 1, 2 are said as éin 's twei /ɛɪ̯n stvɛɪ̯/ unless there is a pause between the two in which case it's éin... twei

21-99
For the numerals between 21 and 99 that are not multiples of ten, the numeral in the ones place is said first followed by the conjunction -un- (always pronounced /ən/ in numerals) and then the number in the tens. Three undergo additional changes:
Éin/Éine → Ein- (never pronounced /ən/ in this case), e.g: einuntwentig (21)
Twei/Twein/Two → Twei-, e.g: tweiuntwentig (22)
Seven → Seevn-, e.g: seevnuntwentig (27)


Ordinal
Ordinal numbers are formed by suffixing the number with -de or -te (if ending in a voiceless consonant) for numbers below 20, and with -st for numbers above 20. Only a few are irregular:
1. Erste
3. Dridde
8. Achte
12. Twäälfte


Collective
These numbers have 2 main uses:
-Denoting value or measurement such as: dollar amount, number of band members, amount in a pack, decades, people with a certain number (such as athletes)
-Denoting ages; translates to English as year-old
It is formed by suffixing -er onto the number. Only a few are irregular:
1er: Einer
5er: Feiver
7er: Seevner
11er: Elver
12er: Twälver (there's also Dusen meaning dozen)
13er: Drittner
Last edited by All4Ɇn on 01 Apr 2019 22:07, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Lapdeutsch

Post by Ælfwine » 24 Mar 2019 17:32

Very nice language. Definitely feels like a German or Dutch dialect, or sociolect.

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Re: Lapdeutsch

Post by All4Ɇn » 28 Mar 2019 05:16

Ælfwine wrote:
24 Mar 2019 17:32
Very nice language. Definitely feels like a German or Dutch dialect, or sociolect.

*is writing down notes*
Glad that you like it! [:D]
I'm not sure whether or not I'd consider it a sociolect. I do think ideally it would be more associated with people in rural parts of Western Germany and Eastern Netherlands but I don't know if there'd be much code switching since I would like it to have more usage than other dialects. Maybe similar to how Frisian is in the Netherlands or maybe even Luxembourgish's status in Luxembourg.

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Re: Lapdeutsch

Post by All4Ɇn » 01 Apr 2019 20:36

Selv/Self/Selve
Considering how many different forms and usages there are for this word I figured I should go into each of them

Selv- Noun
When used as a neuter noun, Selv translates quite simply as "self" and has the plural form Selve.

Selv- Adjective
When used as an adjective, selv means "same" and is most commonly used with definite articles and demonstrative determiners. If used after a definite article, it combines with it and the article is unstressed and pronounced with a schwa, e.g: deselve /dəˈzɛlvə/ (the same). If the article itself is contracted with a preposition, the form of selv does not combine with it, e.g: im selven (in the same). Additionally, if selv occurs right after the demonstrative dis, it is combined with it forming disselve /dəˈsɛlvə/ (this same); however, if dis takes any ending it is no longer contracted with selv, e.g: dise selve /ˈdiːzə ˈzɛlvə/ (these same).

Self- Adverb
When used as an adverb, self adds emphasis to the word before it such as: dat Kind self (the kid itself). This construction is used far more often than -self constructions are in English. If it is used after a personal pronoun, the pronoun is attached to it and is unstressed and pronounced with a schwa, e.g: ikself /əkˈzɛlf/ (I myself). This is also how the stressed reflexive pronouns mentioned earlier are formed.

Selve- Adverb
When used as an adverb, selve has 2 fairly distinct uses from that of self:
1. Stresses that something alone is the object/subject of the verb as opposed to other things included, e.g: "Was it dat Blüü selve, dat hin ergav?" ("was it the lead alone/itself that poisoned him?").
2. Indicates something is the model/real version of a (typically abstract) noun, e.g: Perfektion selve (perfection itself), Leuv selve (love itself), God selve (God himself).

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Re: Lapdeutsch

Post by Zé do Rock » 12 May 2019 18:34

Dis lapdeutsh hav einige paralele mid mei kaudadeutsh. Das is en internacionaliset un multiculti deutsh. Fremdworde wo megli, un die hodeutshe laudvershivu werd rukgangli maket, so dat es a starke plattdüütsh element ha (un die sprekis von andre germanishe spraken cann es fil betta capie):

This lapdeutsh has some parallels with my kaudadeutsh. This is an internationalized and multiculti german. Loanwords wherever possible, and the hochdeutsh consonant shift is cancelled, so it has a strong plattdüütsh element (and the speakers of other germanic languages can understand it much better):


Un er ha tu die weckor hinover se, dat aup die box ticket. "Himmelishe Pap", denket er. Es war half siven, un die ceigors ha ruli vorwerts ge, es war sogar over half, es ha sui sho tu drei firdel vernah. Had die weckor nit leud? Ma ha vo die bedd aus se, dat es aup 4 ur einstellet war; gewiss had es au leud. Ya, aver war es megli, dise möble-ershittali leuden ruli tu verslap? Nu, ruli had er nit slap, aver warsheinli desto festa. Wat sollat er nu du? Die nexte tug hab um siven ur ge; um dat eintuhol, havat er sik unsinnli eile muss, un die coleccion war noh nit einpaket, un er self fuilet sui duraus nit special frish un bewegli. Un self wenn er die tug einholat, a donnawedda vo die sheff war nit tu vermeid, denn die bani had bei die fif-ur-tug wart un sei verseumu langst meld.


Aver mannigmal klingt dat erder as min metaplatt, dat is en misk vun fele platt-dialekten, de wör un förm wart na fakenheid, kortheid un logik (in de transfer vun hoog- to platdüütsh) bestemt:

But sometimes it sounds rather like my metaplatt, thats a mix of many platt-dialects, the words and forms are determined by frequency, brevity and logic (in the transfer from high to low german):

Un he seeg to de wecker henöver, de up de kasten tick. "Hevenlig Vader", denk he. Et wer klock halv söven, un de wisers gungen ruig vörwards, et wer sogar halv vöröver, et neger sik al drefeertel. Shull de wecker nich lüd hebben? Een seeg vunt bedd ut, dat he up klock feer richtig instelt wer; wiss harr he ok lüd. Ja, aver wer dat möglig, disse lüden, dat de möbels to bevern bring, ruig to verslapen? Nu, ruig harr he nich slaapt, aver waarshienlig ümso faster. Aver wat shull he nu don? De neegste tog gung üm klock söven; üm de intohalen, harr he sik unsinnig be-ilen mutten, un de kolekshon wer noch nich inpakt, un he sülven föl sik dörut nich besunners frish un beweeglig. Un sülven wenn he de tog inhol, en dunnerwedder vun de sheff wer nich to vermiden, wil de gesheftdener harr bi de klock-fif-tog töövt un sin versüm langst melt.

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Re: Lapdeutsch

Post by All4Ɇn » 19 Jun 2019 19:13

Zé do Rock wrote:
12 May 2019 18:34
This lapdeutsh has some parallels with my kaudadeutsh. This is an internationalized and multiculti german. Loanwords wherever possible, and the hochdeutsh consonant shift is cancelled, so it has a strong plattdüütsh element (and the speakers of other germanic languages can understand it much better):

But sometimes it sounds rather like my metaplatt, thats a mix of many platt-dialects, the words and forms are determined by frequency, brevity and logic (in the transfer from high to low german):
Wow there definitely are quite a bit of similarities it seems [:)]. Seems like both of us like to mix with High and Low German. I like seeing how much of this I can figure out.

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Re: Lapdeutsch

Post by All4Ɇn » 19 Jun 2019 20:20

/ʊ/ vs /ɔ/
Due to its proximity to Low German speaking areas where /ʊ/ is typically either not present or an allophone of /ɔ/, High German speaking areas where they're typically distinct, and Central German dialects which vary in how they treat the phonemes, the development of /ʊ/ and /ɔ/ in Lapdeutsch from Proto-Germanic /*u/ is a bit complicated. Below is an explanation of when each sound is typically used. This does not count loanwords where both sounds can occur with much more frequency outside of these environments

/ʊ/
Proto-Germanic /*u/ in most cases becomes /ʊ/ in Lapdeutsch some sample words include:
Dust- Dirt
Dunkel- Dark
Unweder- Thunderstorm

/ɔ/
Proto-Germanic /*u/ typically becomes /ɔ/ in Lapdeutsch before the consonants /m p b k f l r/, e.g:
Komd- Arrival
Ock- Also
Oppnen- (to) Open
Schoffel- Shovel
Storm- Windstorm

/ɔ/ is also found in nouns which lengthen their vowel when an ending is added such as:
God /ɡɔt/- God (compare dative form Gode /ˈɡoːdə/)
Schot /ʃɔt/- Shot (compare dative form Schote /ˈʃoːtə/)
Slot /slɔt/- Lock/castle (compare dative form Slote /ˈsloːtə/)

/ʊ/ or /ɔ/
Before the consonants /ɡ ç/ or the consonant clusters /nd nt ld lt/ both /ʊ/ and /ɔ/ can be found
Rugg- Back vs. Rogge- Rye
Dochter- Daughter vs. Flucht- Escape
Schuld- Guilt vs. Gold- Gold
Sunden- South vs. Sonder- Though

Exceptions
Even outside of loanwords there are exceptions to these rules including the following:
Burg- Castle (occurs due to analogy with the plural form Bürge and the related term Bürger)
Pullen- Turkey (occurs due to it being an onomatopoeia)
Summer- Summer (occurs due to analogy with Sunne (sun))
Um- Around
Up- On/above

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Re: Lapdeutsch

Post by Zé do Rock » 30 Jul 2019 18:23

All4Ɇn wrote:
19 Jun 2019 20:20
/ʊ/ vs /ɔ/

/ʊ/
Proto-Germanic /*u/ in most cases becomes /ʊ/ in Lapdeutsch some sample words include:
Dust- Dirt
Dunkel- Dark
Unweder- Thunderstorm

I frage mi, warum 'dust' pro 'drek' - dat giv es nur in inglish, un nit exact mid die selfe bedeud... o lig i da falsh?
Ik frag mi, worüm 'dust' för 'dreck' - dat geevt et blot in engelsh, un nich nau mid de glike bedüd... or ligg ik da falsh?
I ask myself, why 'dust' for 'dirt' - the word only exists in english, and not exactly with the same meening... or am i wrong?

In kaudadeutsh (vocale wi in hodeutsh): drek, dunkel, unwedder
In metaplatt (as in de meeste platt-dialekten): dreck, dunkel, unweder

/ɔ/
Proto-Germanic /*u/ typically becomes /ɔ/ in Lapdeutsch before the consonants /m p b k f l r/, e.g:
Komd- Arrival
Ock- Also
Oppnen- (to) Open
Schoffel- Shovel
Storm- Windstorm

I nem an, 'ock' ha kurt O, wie God un Schot. Warum hav 'ock' CK, aver God un Schot sei nit 'Godd' un 'Schott'?
Ik neem an, 'ock' het kort O, as God un Schot. Worüm het 'ock' CK, aver God un Schot sünd nich 'Godd' un 'Schott'?
I suppose that 'ock' has short O, as God and Schot. Why does 'ock' have CK, but God and Schot are not 'Godd' and 'Schott'?

Kaudadeutsh: (el) ancomm, au/k (K vor vocal), oppenen, shaufel, sturm, godd, shot, slott
Metaplatt: de ankomm, ok, openmaken/opmaken, shüpp, storm, godd, shot /shout/, slott

wat meine yu mid 'schot'? lap?
wat meens du mid 'schot? lap?
what do you mean with 'schot'? lap?'

/ɔ/ is also found in nouns which lengthen their vowel when an ending is added such as:
God /ɡɔt/- God (compare dative form Gode /ˈɡoːdə/)
Schot /ʃɔt/- Shot (compare dative form Schote /ˈʃoːtə/)
Slot /slɔt/- Lock/castle (compare dative form Slote /ˈsloːtə/)

/ʊ/ or /ɔ/
Before the consonants /ɡ ç/ or the consonant clusters /nd nt ld lt/ both /ʊ/ and /ɔ/ can be found
Rugg- Back vs. Rogge- Rye
Dochter- Daughter vs. Flucht- Escape
Schuld- Guilt vs. Gold- Gold
Sunden- South vs. Sonder- Though

Exceptions
Even outside of loanwords there are exceptions to these rules including the following:
Burg- Castle (occurs due to analogy with the plural form Bürge and the related term Bürger)
Pullen- Turkey (occurs due to it being an onomatopoeia)
Summer- Summer (occurs due to analogy with Sunne (sun))
Um- Around
Up- On/above
KD-rucke, dota, shuld, sondan, burg, puti, somma/er, um, aup
MT-rügg, dochter, shuld, sunnern, borg, put/kalkun, sommer, üm, up

pullen, onomatopeia, hmm, i wonder...

Wiss yu wifile wordes i pro 'ameise' in die platt-dialekte findet? A ganze quantiteet...:
Weets du wuvele wör ik för 'ameise' in de platt-dialekten fund? En heel batzen...:
Do you know how many words i found for 'ant' in the low german dialects? A whole lot...:

aimpen, anmieger, eemk 3, holtkätter, holtkötter, iemecken, kamenzel, kamenzell, knaulpann, kramäitzen, krameaz, krameiz, kramenz, meegkatt, meekatt, memops, michdriper, michim, michkatt, michmopse, michmoratze, midelreem 2, miechhampel, miechhejmkje, miechlämke, miegaamke, miegamel, miegamken, miegamme, miegammelke, miegampe, miegamerke, miegeem 2, miegeemk, miegeemke, miegeleem, miegelke 2, miegelreem 2, miegemm, miegemmken, miegemops, mieger, miegerimm, miegeritz, miegeritze, miegerke, miegertje, miegeumken, mieghamer, mieghämpe, miegheemke 2, mieghemke, mieghemmke, miegimke, miegmantje, miegmops, miegreem, miehampe, miejemacke, mielenknieper, mielkatt, miemelittken, miemelütgen, mier, miere, miereem, millemops, moormür, muureen, pissmiegel, pismich, pismieg, pismier, pismil, pismiu, pissebült, pissmichel, pissmier, pissmiere, pissmirmke, rademp, radent, radimp, radint, rodimm, rodipp, sprockimm 2

Die netteste is in mei meinu 'millemops'. I nemet 'mir' (wi in hollish), un pro die spass, 'millemops'.
De netteste is na min meen 'millemops'. Ik nom 'mir' (as in hollansh), un för de spass, 'millemops'.
The nicest one is in my opinion 'millemops'. I took 'mir' (as in dutch), and for the fun, 'millemops'.

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Re: Lapdeutsch

Post by Zé do Rock » 30 Jul 2019 18:24

pardon, i ha die quotations vergett...
pardon, ik heb de quotations vergeet...
sorry, i forgot the quotations...

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Re: Lapdeutsch

Post by All4Ɇn » 02 Aug 2019 05:54

Thanks for the questions!
Zé do Rock wrote:
30 Jul 2019 18:23
I ask myself, why 'dust' for 'dirt' - the word only exists in english, and not exactly with the same meening... or am i wrong?
It also occurs in Swedish and there are also two obsolete/archaic terms of the same origin in Dutch and German: duist and Dust respectively, both meaning dust as well with duist apparently also having the meaning of pollen. I wanted a very different for dirt and I really liked the idea of using Dust for it.
Zé do Rock wrote:
30 Jul 2019 18:23
I suppose that 'ock' has short O, as God and Schot. Why does 'ock' have CK, but God and Schot are not 'Godd' and 'Schott'?
God and Schot are spelled with single consonants in order to reflect that when an ending is added to them, the vowel lengthens. Otherwise these words would alternate between having a single consonant and a double consonant in different forms of the word.
Zé do Rock wrote:
30 Jul 2019 18:23
what do you mean with 'schot'? lap?'
Schot means a shot as in an instance of shooting. Lap- is cognate with SD Lappen meaning cloth/rag and refers to the fact that Lapdeutsch was seen as a lower-class version of German.
Zé do Rock wrote:
30 Jul 2019 18:23
Do you know how many words i found for 'ant' in the low german dialects? A whole lot...:

The nicest one is in my opinion 'millemops'. I took 'mir' (as in dutch), and for the fun, 'millemops'.
Wow this list really gets the mind jogging for ideas for the word for ant! And I definitely agree with millemops being the best. Sounds like an English speakers idea of what another Germanic language would stereotypically sound like

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Re: Lapdeutsch

Post by Zé do Rock » 07 Aug 2019 07:42

All4Ɇn wrote:
02 Aug 2019 05:54
God and Schot are spelled with single consonants in order to reflect that when an ending is added to them, the vowel lengthens. Otherwise these words would alternate between having a single consonant and a double consonant in different forms of the word.
Worüm wart de vokal lang wenn disse wör en ennung kriegt? Is dat jümmer so or blot bi bestimte wör, un wat is de vördeel?
Why does these words get a long vowel when they gets an ending? Is it always like that or just some words, and wat is the advantage?
Schot means a shot as in an instance of shooting. Lap- is cognate with SD Lappen meaning cloth/rag and refers to the fact that Lapdeutsch was seen as a lower-class version of German.
Ah, OK. Aver en god werbung för de sprak is dat nich, or?
Ah, OK. But it doesn't sound like a good publicity for the language, does it?
Zé do Rock wrote:
30 Jul 2019 18:23
Do you know how many words i found for 'ant' in the low german dialects? A whole lot...:
Wow this list really gets the mind jogging for ideas for the word for ant! And I definitely agree with millemops being the best. Sounds like an English speakers idea of what another Germanic language would stereotypically sound like
Filicht maags du ok de list vun de wör för 'schmetterling':
Maybe you also like the list with the words for 'butterfly':

bodderlicker 3, boddervogel, botterlicker 3, bottervagel 2, bottervogel, bottervögel, fielapper, fielerke, filapper, filerke, filipper, flatterling, fledderleck, flederling, fleerling 2, fleierling, flelleresch, flerling, flidderling, flinderk, flinderke 2, flinnerk 2, flörlünk, flünchel, maivagel, mäivoggel, pennvogel, rupenkind, schmeddeling, schmetterling, schohlapper, sommerlott, sommervagel, sömmervagel, sommervoggel, spannvogel, sünnenvoggel, sünnvoggel, ulepüle 2 - bodderlicker, bodderfogel, filapper, filerk, filipper, flatterling, fledderleck, flederling, fleierling, flellerersh, flerling, flidderling, flinnerk, flörlüng, flünchel, meifogel, mefogel, penfogel, rupenkind, smeddeling, smetterling, sholapper, sommerlott, sommerfogel, spannfogel, sünnfogel, ulepüle

Ik nom sommerfogel för de fakenheid (in de wörbok un in text), kortheid un logik, aver ok 'fladderling' wil ik dat so moi funn.
I took sommerfogel (sommerbird) for the frequency (in the dictionaries and in text), shortness and logic, but also 'fladderling' (flutterling) becaus i found it so nice...

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Re: Lapdeutsch

Post by All4Ɇn » 12 Aug 2019 06:03

Zé do Rock wrote:
07 Aug 2019 07:42
Why does these words get a long vowel when they gets an ending? Is it always like that or just some words, and wat is the advantage?
Only certain nouns do. It largely lines up with the nouns which undergo the same process in Dutch (e.g: god->goden, schot->schoten)
Zé do Rock wrote:
07 Aug 2019 07:42
Why does these words get a long vowel when they gets an ending? Is it always like that or just some words, and wat is the advantage?
Ah, OK. But it doesn't sound like a good publicity for the language, does it?[/quote]
Not particularly [;)]. But I like to make my languages as realistic as possible and it's almost certain that a language like Lapdeutsch would have been looked down upon throughout most of its history
Zé do Rock wrote:
30 Jul 2019 18:23
Ik nom sommerfogel för de fakenheid (in de wörbok un in text), kortheid un logik, aver ok 'fladderling' wil ik dat so moi funn.
I took sommerfogel (sommerbird) for the frequency (in the dictionaries and in text), shortness and logic, but also 'fladderling' (flutterling) becaus i found it so nice...
I've seen Sommerfogel before and have never forgotten it since then. One of the prettiest words I've ever seen in any Germanic language imo.

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Re: Lapdeutsch

Post by Zé do Rock » 16 Aug 2019 10:13

All4Ɇn wrote:
12 Aug 2019 06:03
Only certain nouns do. It largely lines up with the nouns which undergo the same process in Dutch (e.g: god->goden, schot->schoten)
Dat is recht komish. Ik denk hollansh is regelmatig in disse sinn, aver filicht doch nich? Ik denk 'god' un 'schot' shull korte vokalen hebben, aver dat shient, dat dat nich so is. Geevt et en logishe verklar daför? Wörüm shrievt se nich 'good' un 'schoot'?
Thats quite strange. I thought dutch is regular in this sense, but maybe it is not? I thought 'god' and 'schot' would have short vowels, but it seems that they dont. Is there a logical explanation for it? Why dont they spell 'good' and 'schoot'?
Zé do Rock wrote:
30 Jul 2019 18:23
I've seen Sommerfogel before and have never forgotten it since then. One of the prettiest words I've ever seen in any Germanic language imo.
Ja, in de do en nett word... apropoh, ik heb al lang nich mer sommerfogels seen...
Yeah, indeed a nice word... by the way, i havent seen summerfowels for a long time...

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Re: Lapdeutsch

Post by shimobaatar » 25 Aug 2019 01:38

All4Ɇn wrote:
09 Jan 2019 20:16
Können- Can or Could (when used in the past subjunctive)
All4Ɇn wrote:
09 Jan 2019 20:16
Müten- Must/Have To or Should (when used in the past subjunctive)
All4Ɇn wrote:
09 Jan 2019 20:16
Sollen- Will/Shall or Should (in the sense of possibility when used in the past subjunctive)
All4Ɇn wrote:
09 Jan 2019 20:16
Werden- To Become or Will Be or To Be (Passive) or Would (when used in the past subjunctive)
All4Ɇn wrote:
09 Jan 2019 20:16
Willen- To Want or Will (if impersonal, in questions, or some phrases) or Would Like (when used in the past subjunctive)
Might I request to see what the past subjunctive forms of these verbs look like? Actually, if you're planning to gradually go through the different TAM forms in future posts, disregard this.
All4Ɇn wrote:
16 Jan 2019 21:18
Class 4: /eː/ -> /ɑː/, e.g: beren (to give birth) -> du baars (you gave birth)
All4Ɇn wrote:
16 Jan 2019 21:18
Class 5 Pattern 1: /eː/ -> /ɑː/, e.g: eten (to eat) -> du aats (you ate)
Are these classes only distinguished because they were historically distinct? Actually, looking at the strong verbs in related natural languages, I'm assuming these two classes have different vowels in at least one form, probably the past participle?
All4Ɇn wrote:
16 Jan 2019 21:18
1. In addition to undergoing vowel changes, four strong verbs also undergo consonant changes: freusen (to freeze) has the simple past tense stem fror-, hebben (to raise) has the simple past tense stem huv-, houen (to chop) has the simple past tense stem hiev-, and verleusen (to lose) has the simple past tense stem verlor-
Love that grammatischer Wechsel.
All4Ɇn wrote:
04 Feb 2019 21:23
This/That or These/Those
Probably the main meaning of the word. Practically the same as in Dutch in that respect.
Dat is gud- That/this is good
Dat sind meine Brüder- Those/these are my brothers/siblings
I quite like this. Is this the way things are in German as well, at least colloquially, or am I misremembering?
All4Ɇn wrote:
13 Feb 2019 20:41
Sample Sentences Using Kafka's The Metamorphosis
Excellent! [+1]
All4Ɇn wrote:
24 Mar 2019 14:18
Collective
These numbers have 2 main uses:
-Denoting value or measurement such as: dollar amount, number of band members, amount in a pack, decades, people with a certain number (such as athletes)
-Denoting ages; translates to English as year-old
Could we possibly see a few examples of these usages?
All4Ɇn wrote:
19 Jun 2019 20:20
/ʊ/ or /ɔ/
Before the consonants /ɡ ç/ or the consonant clusters /nd nt ld lt/ both /ʊ/ and /ɔ/ can be found
Rugg- Back vs. Rogge- Rye
Dochter- Daughter vs. Flucht- Escape
Schuld- Guilt vs. Gold- Gold
Sunden- South vs. Sonder- Though
Is there any rhyme or reason to whether *u becomes /ʊ/ or /ɔ/ in these environments, or is it truly random/unpredictable?

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All4Ɇn
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Re: Lapdeutsch

Post by All4Ɇn » 10 Sep 2019 14:15

shimobaatar wrote:
25 Aug 2019 01:38
Might I request to see what the past subjunctive forms of these verbs look like? Actually, if you're planning to gradually go through the different TAM forms in future posts, disregard this.
If you would be interested in seeing the past subjunctive conjugation I'd be more than willing to make a post on it [:)]
shimobaatar wrote:
25 Aug 2019 01:38
Are these classes only distinguished because they were historically distinct? Actually, looking at the strong verbs in related natural languages, I'm assuming these two classes have different vowels in at least one form, probably the past participle?
That is correct. They remain distinct in the past participle
shimobaatar wrote:
25 Aug 2019 01:38
I quite like this. Is this the way things are in German as well, at least colloquially, or am I misremembering?
I think it is also like German for those examples [:)]
shimobaatar wrote:
25 Aug 2019 01:38
Excellent! [+1]
Thanks!

shimobaatar wrote:
25 Aug 2019 01:38
ECould we possibly see a few examples of these usages?
Of course:
-Ik hev ei' Feiver (I have a five euro bill)
-Dreier het de Ball (Number 3 has the ball)
-Dise Band is ei' Vierer (This band is a quartet)
-Dat Seevner Määdjen (The seven year-old girl)
shimobaatar wrote:
25 Aug 2019 01:38
EIs there any rhyme or reason to whether *u becomes /ʊ/ or /ɔ/ in these environments, or is it truly random/unpredictable?
In these cases, I'm basing them largely (with some exceptions) on German's development of these consonants. I'm not sure how German went about it with them however.

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eldin raigmore
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Re: Lapdeutsch

Post by eldin raigmore » 10 Sep 2019 18:52

Of course:
-Ik hev ei' Feiver (I have a five euro bill)
-Dreier het de Ball (Number 3 has the ball)
-Dise Band is ei' Vierer (This band is a quartet)
-Dat Seevner Määdjen (The seven year-old girl)
I like these!

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Creyeditor
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Re: Lapdeutsch

Post by Creyeditor » 10 Sep 2019 21:15

All4Ɇn wrote:
10 Sep 2019 14:15
shimobaatar wrote:
25 Aug 2019 01:38
I quite like this. Is this the way things are in German as well, at least colloquially, or am I misremembering?
I think it is also like German for those examples [:)]
Das ist gut. - That/this is good.
Das sind meine Brüder. - Those/these are my brothers/siblings.

I think this is standard German and not so colloquial. In my colloquial variety of German, this would be any of the following. You usually need some pragmatic context, but the "das" can be dropped.

Das's gut. - That/this is good.
's gut. - That/this is good.
Gut! - That/this is good.
Das sin' meine Brüder. - Those/these are my brothers/siblings.
Sin' meine Brüder. - Those/these are my brothers/siblings.
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