What did you accomplish today?

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Khemehekis
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Re: What did you accomplish today?

Post by Khemehekis » 15 Mar 2018 06:40

The other day I was thinking about the adultcentrism in English's animal names. "Dog" can either mean any dog, or it can mean an adult dog, as opposed to a puppy. When contrasting "puppy" with the adult form of the animal, you have to use "dog", even though puppies can also be dogs too, according to another use of the word. We have special words for males, special words for females, special words for the young of an animal, sometimes even different words for boys and girls (like cockerel vs. pullet) or little boys and little girls (like colt vs. filly) but not special words for the adult form of an animal.

I decided Kankonian will do this differently from English. Kankonian now has a suffix -okh for adult animals. For instance, I have the word karaph, meaning "dog". I also have karaphi*, meaning "puppy". Now I have as well karaphokh, meaning "dog (adult dog, as opposed to a puppy)".
♂♥♂♀

Squirrels chase koi . . . chase squirrels

My Kankonian-English dictionary: 60,137 words and counting

31,416: The number of the conlanging beast!

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gestaltist
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Re: What did you accomplish today?

Post by gestaltist » 15 Mar 2018 10:36

Khemehekis wrote:
15 Mar 2018 06:40
adultcentrism
Is that even a word?

I think your idea is pretty cool and could easily arise from historical augmentatives - especially for species held as pets. It might be less likely for wild species where humans mainly interact with adult specimens, I think.

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Omzinesý
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Re: What did you accomplish today?

Post by Omzinesý » 15 Mar 2018 12:52

I've derived Barqi from Proto-Uralic and Proto-Germanic, and my conlanguage family Vtayn-Mhilva.

So I still don't know what it will be.

Khemehekis
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Re: What did you accomplish today?

Post by Khemehekis » 15 Mar 2018 23:42

gestaltist wrote:
15 Mar 2018 10:36
Khemehekis wrote:
15 Mar 2018 06:40
adultcentrism
Is that even a word?
Yep.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adultcentrism
I think your idea is pretty cool and could easily arise from historical augmentatives - especially for species held as pets. It might be less likely for wild species where humans mainly interact with adult specimens, I think.
Thanks. I'll probably say that -okh started out as an augmentative of some sort. Although Kankonian has -i*, it doesn't have much diminution nor augmentation in the way of affixes. Maybe I'll say it used to have general augmentative and diminutive suffixes, and they ceased to be productive but survived in some words.
♂♥♂♀

Squirrels chase koi . . . chase squirrels

My Kankonian-English dictionary: 60,137 words and counting

31,416: The number of the conlanging beast!

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KaiTheHomoSapien
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Re: What did you accomplish today?

Post by KaiTheHomoSapien » 16 Mar 2018 05:48

I feel as if I understand PIE morphology more every time I read about it. I understand the verbal system better now than I did last week, and I understood it better last week than I did when I last worked on my conlang. I'm having to amend my conlang the more I understand PIE's complexity.
Last edited by KaiTheHomoSapien on 18 Mar 2018 17:01, edited 1 time in total.

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Reyzadren
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Re: What did you accomplish today?

Post by Reyzadren » 18 Mar 2018 10:43

I added griuskant features onto the CALS website to be analysed, as far as I know it.

It scored 66% on conlang averageness, which means it more likely resembles your typical boring normal standard conlang. Woo~
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Parlox
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Re: What did you accomplish today?

Post by Parlox » 21 Mar 2018 03:34

I've completely redone Bàsupan noun forms, and am doing the same with verbs. I've also decided to have adjectives instead of using verbs.
  • :con: Cajun, a descendant of French spoken in Louisiana.
  • :con: Bàsupan, loosely inspired by Amharic.
  • :con: Oddúhath Claire, a fusion of Welsh and Arabic.

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Re: What did you accomplish today?

Post by Ælfwine » 21 Mar 2018 04:23

I've probably flip flopped on adding gender to Pelsodian (or Castellian or whichever shall it be named) so many times before, but I think I have a good idea on how to execute it.

Using Creyeditor's idea, I've decided that gender would be perserved, but marked only on the definite article. The one exception is in the accusative case, where there is no definite article: instead a final -a (unstressed: [ə]) marks the feminine gender, and the preposition a marks the case.

ła cenj
the-F dog

but

a cenja
to (the) dog.F

indefinite forms are simply using the indefinite article, no preposition or anything necessary really.

una cenj
(to) the-F dog

I imagine though in practice this is omitted often when unnecessary... you could get by saying just "cenj" after the verb in the DO...no need to mark (in)definiteness there.

So what influences do we see here affecting this romlang? German (gender marking on article), Slavic (omission of article), and Hungarian/Turkish (how the accusative is marked).
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loglorn
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Re: What did you accomplish today?

Post by loglorn » 21 Mar 2018 18:15

AFAICT all romlangs mark gender in articles so that's not really surprising. Marking gender only in articles is a more interesting development. In my opinion marking gender only in articles would make the articles less likely to be dropped, due to having more semantic load. Like for instance vernacular Brazilian Portuguese articles, the only place where number is marked, which are retained in all environments i can think of.
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Ælfwine
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Re: What did you accomplish today?

Post by Ælfwine » 21 Mar 2018 20:48

loglorn wrote:
21 Mar 2018 18:15
AFAICT all romlangs mark gender in articles so that's not really surprising. Marking gender only in articles is a more interesting development. In my opinion marking gender only in articles would make the articles less likely to be dropped, due to having more semantic load. Like for instance vernacular Brazilian Portuguese articles, the only place where number is marked, which are retained in all environments i can think of.
Hmm. Then maybe I don't want articles given the areal influences. Of course I could say the same thing about gender (it's in slavic languages, but not Hungarian and probably not Avar). Back to the drawing board for now.
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Crimean Gothic — A Gothic language spoken in Crimea (duh)
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Jezik Panoski — A Slavic language spoken in the same area
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Reyzadren
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Re: What did you accomplish today?

Post by Reyzadren » 25 Mar 2018 07:04

Added myself with a general fiction novel onto the frathwiki page.

This brings the total to 7 griuskant publications now.
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Scytheria
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Re: What did you accomplish today?

Post by Scytheria » 25 Mar 2018 11:17

Solved about 90% of the problems emerging in my artlang by restricting root words to a single syllable. Now to revise about 20,000 words of grammatical definition...
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Omzinesý
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Re: What did you accomplish today?

Post by Omzinesý » 26 Mar 2018 10:51

Decided to add humble consonant gradation to my Uralic lang. It only appears when the root vowels is a single sonoric consont. In Strong grade the consont is prestopped. The preceding syllable is still open and can have a diphtong.

Éna 'woman'

NOM éne [eine]
ACC édne [ei.dne]

Kóle 'school'

NOM kóle [ku:le]
ACC kódle [ku:.dle]

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Ahzoh
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Re: What did you accomplish today?

Post by Ahzoh » 26 Mar 2018 11:20

I originally indicated the construct state for biconsonantal roots through the pattern ʾeCC, but this created too many illegal consonant clusters so now Vrkhazhian indicates it with the removal of the gender endings and inverse voicing of the final consonant:

šada "mouth" > šat "mouth-of"
šuḳi "king" > šug "king-of"
bala "path" > baś "path-of"
hazi "man" > has "man-of"

The construct state can also be used predicatively, like the Akkadian status absolutus:
ḳa tuhas.
2ms-NOM ACC-man\CONS-SG
ḳa tuhazi yu.
2ms-NOM man ACC-man-MASC.SG be\ACT.PRES.SG
He is a man.

Vrkhazhian now has an instrumental case, mostly to indicate the theme of a ditransitive verb. Vrkhazhian also no longer has progressive tenses but still makes a distinction between realis (factual) and irrealis (counterfactual) tenses.
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Omzinesý
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Re: What did you accomplish today?

Post by Omzinesý » 26 Mar 2018 11:38

Omzinesý wrote:
26 Mar 2018 10:51
Decided to add humble consonant gradation to my Uralic lang. It only appears when the root vowels is a single sonoric consont. In Strong grade the consont is prestopped. The preceding syllable is still open and can have a diphtong.

Éna 'woman'

NOM éne [eine]
ACC édne [ei.dne]

Kóle 'school'

NOM kóle [ku:le]
ACC kódle [ku:.dle]
Loan words also have prestopped sonorants word-initially.
Tran, trande 'beach, coast' <- Swe. strand
Kňyt, kňytte 'guy'

All plosives cannot precede a sonorant word-initially and reduce to prestopped sonorants.
Trize 'crisis'
Trop, troppe 'body' <- Swe. kroppa

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Dezinaa
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Re: What did you accomplish today?

Post by Dezinaa » 27 Mar 2018 07:26

I figured out how to do causatives in Otvei. They use the word un, meaning simply "cause, make," followed by the subordinating particle ek, followed by the action that was caused to happen.

Ex:
Ro unai ek sep amzeai.
fire.NOM cause-3SG SUBORD ice.NOM melt-3SG
The fire melts the ice. (Literally: The fire causes that the ice melts. Amze is always intransitive, which is why a causative construction is needed.)

Khemehekis
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Re: What did you accomplish today?

Post by Khemehekis » 29 Mar 2018 10:51

A Kankonian rule I've had for a while:

A noun one of which belongs to each of many is kept in the singular if each has only one of them. For instance, you would say:

Geteres Dantonik alushen hothos na mem hair heshra.
soldier-PL Danton-ian sacrifice-PST life of 3p for heshra
The Dantonese soldiers gave their life for the heshra.

Instead of:

Geteres Dantonik alushen hothas na mem hair heshra.
soldier-PL Danton-ian sacrifice-PST life-PL of 3p for heshra
The Dantonese soldiers gave their lives for the heshra.

Today, a new twist on it:

The exception is with a noun like "shakti" (house) for which more than one possessor could be ambiguous. In such cases, the singular is used if the multiple possessors share a single unit, and the plural used if the multiple possessors each have their own unit:

Is shahemden shakti na Zhoya mui Vrandi.
1s go_down_to-PST house of Zhoya and Vrandi
I went down to Zhoya and Vrandi's house.

Kam sayup spas is adiros shaktas na Mark mui Asha.
on next week 1s visit-FUT house-PL of Mark and Asha
Next week, I will visit Mark's and Asha's houses.

Wiri mui mopiga retelen shakti na mem.
man and woman paint-PST house of 3p
The man and woman painted their house. [They live in the same house.]

Wiri mui mopiga retelen shaktas na mem.
man and woman paint-PST house-PL of 3p
The man and woman painted their houses. [They live in the different houses.]
♂♥♂♀

Squirrels chase koi . . . chase squirrels

My Kankonian-English dictionary: 60,137 words and counting

31,416: The number of the conlanging beast!

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Lambuzhao
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Re: What did you accomplish today?

Post by Lambuzhao » 29 Mar 2018 12:45

Why not just use /hal/ to emphasize that each person has a house?

E.G.

Is shahemden shakti na Zhoya mui Vrandi
1s go_down_to-PST house of Zhoya and Vrandi
I went down to Zhoya and Vrandi's house.
(They both own the same house which I visited)

BUT

Is shahemden shakti nahal Zhoya mui Vrandi.
1s go_down_to-PST house of=each Zhoya and Vrandi
I went down to Zhoya and Vrandi's houses.
(I visited the houses of each of them)
:?: :wat: :?:

Or mebbe the other way around, since /hal/ is a root that seems to mean 'every' or 'all' (collective) , yet you have that little idiomatic usage where is can mean "each"

…Or mebbe not.
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Omzinesý
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Re: What did you accomplish today?

Post by Omzinesý » 06 Apr 2018 20:36

Ahzoh wrote:
26 Mar 2018 11:20
I originally indicated the construct state for biconsonantal roots through the pattern ʾeCC, but this created too many illegal consonant clusters so now Vrkhazhian indicates it with the removal of the gender endings and inverse voicing of the final consonant:

šada "mouth" > šat "mouth-of"
šuḳi "king" > šug "king-of"
bala "path" > baś "path-of"
hazi "man" > has "man-of"

The construct state can also be used predicatively, like the Akkadian status absolutus:
ḳa tuhas.
2ms-NOM ACC-man\CONS-SG
ḳa tuhazi yu.
2ms-NOM man ACC-man-MASC.SG be\ACT.PRES.SG
He is a man.

Vrkhazhian now has an instrumental case, mostly to indicate the theme of a ditransitive verb. Vrkhazhian also no longer has progressive tenses but still makes a distinction between realis (factual) and irrealis (counterfactual) tenses.
What would the historical cause for inverse voicing be?
I see final devoicing is very common, but what causes the final voicing?

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Ahzoh
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Re: What did you accomplish today?

Post by Ahzoh » 06 Apr 2018 22:50

Omzinesý wrote:
06 Apr 2018 20:36
What would the historical cause for inverse voicing be?
I see final devoicing is very common, but what causes the final voicing?
Probably the same ones as Dholuo.
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