Before the car hit it

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Imralu
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Re: Before the car hit it

Post by Imralu » 28 Sep 2017 21:20

:tan: Swahili:

Tulimwokoa mbwa kabla gari halijamgunga.
tu-li-mw-oko-a mbwa kabla gari ha-li-ja-m-gung-a
1p-PST-1-save-Ø dog(1) before car(5) NEG-5-not.yet-1-collide-Ø

We saved the dog before the car hit it.
(Literally more like "We saved the dog before the car hadn't hit it yet.")
Glossing Abbreviations: COMP = comparative, C = complementiser, ACS / ICS = accessible / inaccessible, GDV = gerundive, SPEC / NSPC = specific / non-specific, AG = agent, E = entity (person, animal, thing)
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Parlox
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Re: Before the car hit it

Post by Parlox » 30 Sep 2017 00:31

Pod
Ttåmy by atod våroćisa ńid ǵóttansa póṭa dan.
[ʈɑmi pʼi atɑd vɑɹɑt͡ʃʼɪsa ŋɪd kʼɤʈansa pɤtʼa dan]
save.TRANS-PER multiple 1ST.NOM valur-DEF hit.TRANS car-DEF before 3RD.NEU.ACC
We saved the dog before the car hit it. (lit, multiple i saved the valur the car before hit it)

(Valurs are beagle-like creatures that exist on my conworld, Sorpear.)

Makǔdorın
Y̌ǔmsun ats muǰǒn yına sahsǔm ke ats gomaǰ gomez
[ɟʌmsɯn at͡s mɯd͡ʒɘn cina saxsʌm kɛ at͡s gɤmad͡ʒ gɤmɛz]
help.TRANS-PRES.ACT.TRANS PROX dog 1ST.NOM-PLUR(W) hit.TRANS-PAST.PASS.TRANS 3RD.NEU.ACC PROX car before
We saved the dog before the car hit it. (lit, We helped that dog that car before hit it)
  • :con: Cajun, a descendant of French spoken in Louisiana.
  • :con: Bàsupan, loosely inspired by Amharic.
  • :con: Oddúhath Claire, a fusion of Welsh and Arabic.

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Davush
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Re: Before the car hit it

Post by Davush » 30 Sep 2017 12:02

Both the gerund and past tense can be used, but it is ambiguous whether the car did/did not hit the dog. The gerund is considered more 'correct'.

rarshi ăsh zuazuda-n miava-nda, cuan-a á-năths-un.
/ɾaɾʃi ǝʃ dzu:ǝdzudan mi:ǝvanda ku:ǝna a:nǝθsun/

wagon 3p.ACC hit.GER-GEN before-CONJ, dog-ACC PAST-save-1pl
'before the wagon's hitting it (and) we saved the dog'

Qutrussan prefers to link clauses with the suffix -anda which I call a generic 'connective' suffix. There is probably a more fitting name for it, though.

Iyionaku
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Re: Before the car hit it

Post by Iyionaku » 30 Sep 2017 20:51

:deu: German

Wir haben den Hund gerettet, bevor ihn das Auto überfahren hätte.
[viɐ̯ ˈhaːbən den hʊnt gəˈʁɛtʰət, bəˈfɔɐ̯ ʔiːn das ˈʔaʊ̯tʰo ˌʔyːbɐˈfaːɐn ˈhɛtʰə]
1PL.NOM AUX.PST.1PL DEF.MASC.ACC dog save.PP, before 3SG.MASC.ACC DEF.NEUT.NOM car drive_over.PP AUX.PST.COND.PST.3SG
We saved the dog before the car hit it.

The German verb for "to hit" is "treffen" in this context, but somehow it felt weird to use it in this context. For some reason, the verb "überfahren" (to drive over so./sth.) is always used for a collision between a vehicle and a passenger, even if the latter is only brushed by the former.

:con: Yélian

Yipamest a'teriys desiy diyilacveit un'aélico.
[ɕɨˈpaːməst ɐˈteːɾa̯iːʃ ˈdeːsa̯iː dɨɕɨˈlakvɛɪ̯t ʉnaˈeːlɨko]
PST-save-1PLEX DEF.ANIM=dog before COND-PST-hit-INV.COND.3SG.ANIM DEF.INAN=car
We saved the dog before it were hit by the car.

:con: Caelian

Rer taruit siwutersiz vorwapif kalrej Tang tistükimnas.
[rɛh tʰaˈrʊɪ̯t ʒi.utɛɾˈʒis vɔɾwaˈpʰiɸ kʰalˈrɛj tʰaŋ tʰiʃtʰykʰimˈnaʃ]
1SG.NOM dog.ACC PST-save.1PLEX>3SG before car.NOM 3SG.FEM.ACC COND.PST-hit.3SG>3SG-can
We saved the dog before the car hit it.

:con: Ular

狗兽得保维有咱就去得德砗惹为岩负能它。
Wónkūng tā phú'āj jù lár mûlhù tā tájāng ôr nùnglhó kă pár tōn.

[ʊɔn˥kuŋ˧ tɛ˧ pʰu˥aj˧ ju˩ lɛɹ˥ mu˥ʟu˩ tɛ˧ tɛ˥jaŋ˧ ɔɹ˧˥ nyŋ˩ʟɔ˥ ka˥˧ pɑɹ˥ tɔn˧]
dog TOP save PST 1PL before TOP car cause hit suffer can 3SG.NEUT
We saved the dog before the car hit it.

:con: Bath'aso

Shels khek dronabz parnul zar khats parnřokuzh krħedstshkedzhizt.
[ʂɛls kʰɛk ˈdrɔnɐbz pɑɾnul zɑɾ kʰɑt͡s ˈpɑɾnuluʐ krʕɛdstʂkɛ͡dʐizt]
POT PERF save=1PL.ERG dog-likable.ABS NEG hit dog-scared-INDR carriage-artificial-threatening-INST
We could save the dog [we like it very much] so the dog [we were scared for it] was not hit by a car [that was threatening].

:con: Paatherye

वौ तेऌप़ कड़ू मा क्वाड़़ ठोम मे त्रायाठ फामि क्रुतू ध्रा.
Wey telpan karū mā kwāran thēma me trāyātha phāmi krutū dhrā.

[wei̯ ˈtelpan ˈkaruː maː ˈkwaːran ˈtʰeːma me traːˈjaːtʰa ˈpʰaːmi ˈkrutuː θraː]
1PL.NOM AUX.AOR.1PL save.PP DEF.FEM.ACC dog.ACC before DEF.MASC.NOM car.NOM AUX.AOR.COND.3SG hit.PP 3SG.FEM.ACC
We have saved the dog before the car would have hit it.
Wipe the glass. This is the usual way to start, even in the days, day and night, only a happy one.

Alessio
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Re: Before the car hit it

Post by Alessio » 30 Sep 2017 22:20

:ita: Italiano
Abbiamo salvato il cane prima che la macchina lo colpisse.
/ab'bjaːmo sal'vaːto il 'kaːne 'priːma ke la 'makkina lo kol'pisse/
abb-iamo salv-ato il cane prima che la macchina lo colp-isse
have-1PL save-PART.PASS DET.MS dog before that DET.FS car 3SG.M.OBJ hit-3SG.SUBJ.PAST


The subjunctive mood is used, since the action didn't happen, and is thus purely hypothetical; however, "prima che" always needs to be followed by a verb in the subjunctive mood, so this isn't particularly noticeable in this sentence. If the car had hit the dog, you'd have to turn the whole sentence around to make it evident; a possible way to do so would be "we saved the dog, but then the car hit it" (abbiamo salvato il cane, ma poi la macchina l'ha colpito).
As a side note: probably the verb "investire" (so "investisse") is more appropriate than "colpire", although less literal (it means "to run over").
:ita: :eng: [:D] | :fra: :esp: :rus: [:)] | :con: Hecathver, Hajás, Hedetsūrk, Darezh...

Tin't inameint ca tót a sàm stê żōv'n e un po' cajoun, mo s't'armâgn cajoun an vōl ménga dîr t'armâgn anc żōven...

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Parlox
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Re: Before the car hit it

Post by Parlox » 30 Sep 2017 23:17

H̱ěrkxaas̱ǐ
H̱oṟtěr nǐs e koḵao fǔvv̌aatěr e ṯǔis̱e ṯutra toṟ
[ʀɤʟtəɹ nʌs ɛ kɤqaɤ fɯvwɑtəɹ ɛ θɯiʃɛ θut͡ɹ̥a tɤʟ]
save.TRANS-PAST.PER 1ST.ERG.COL DEF dog-ACC.SGV strike.TRANS-PAST.PER DEF car-ERG.SGV-TI before 3RD.NEU.ACC
We saved the dog before the car hit it. (lit, We saved the dog the car before strikes it)
  • :con: Cajun, a descendant of French spoken in Louisiana.
  • :con: Bàsupan, loosely inspired by Amharic.
  • :con: Oddúhath Claire, a fusion of Welsh and Arabic.

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Evynova
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Re: Before the car hit it

Post by Evynova » 08 Nov 2017 10:20

:con: K'anerhtówhí

Aninnúhakính wishénn at'anirhúk hénk'erek'árrh.
/ɑnɪnːuhɑkʏn̥ wɪsʰœnː ɑt’ɑnɪr̥uk hœn̥k’ɛrɛk’ɑr̥ː/
Ani-m=núha=ak-ính wishén=m at'a=ani-rh-úk hénk'erek'an=rh
3SG.NH-OBL=save=NP-1PL dog=OBL strike=3SG.NH-GEN-ALL car-GEN


We saved the dog before the car hit it

The dog "possesses" the hit from the car; the car "possesses" its hit.
Towards the hitting used to mean "before", as in leading up to the hit
Car is "wolfless-wheel-sledge"
Dog is "care-wolf"

Void
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Re: Before the car hit it

Post by Void » 08 Nov 2017 12:28

Image

Ûzmeklen kiras athar amjutkung rihém ires.
[ˈyːzme̞kle̞n ˈkirɑs ˈɑθɑr ˈɑmjutkuŋ ˈriçe̞ːm ˈire̞s]
rescue-1PL.PST dog-ACC before run.over-3SG.PST-SUBJ car 3SG.IN-ACC
"We saved the dog before the car hit it."
Qōxyatha'xothri (Qohic)

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Creyeditor
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Re: Before the car hit it

Post by Creyeditor » 08 Nov 2017 22:26

Iyionaku wrote::deu: German

Wir haben den Hund gerettet, bevor ihn das Auto überfahren hätte.
[viɐ̯ ˈhaːbən den hʊnt gəˈʁɛtʰət, bəˈfɔɐ̯ ʔiːn das ˈʔaʊ̯tʰo ˌʔyːbɐˈfaːɐn ˈhɛtʰə]
1PL.NOM AUX.PST.1PL DEF.MASC.ACC dog save.PP, before 3SG.MASC.ACC DEF.NEUT.NOM car drive_over.PP AUX.PST.COND.PST.3SG
We saved the dog before the car hit it.
Anfahren (lit. do drive on or to drive against s.th.) is another verb that would fit here, right?
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Reyzadren
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Re: Before the car hit it

Post by Reyzadren » 09 Nov 2017 00:52

:con: griuskant (without the conscript)

aeskes pauja vosk gayez sun detha raes.
/'eskəs 'paudʒa 'vɔsk 'gajəz 'sun 'dəθa 'res/
1PL safe-V dog before car collide-V 3SG
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Lao Kou
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Re: Before the car hit it

Post by Lao Kou » 09 Nov 2017 13:23

Khemehekis wrote:
Omzinesý wrote:Does any language distinguish the situation where the dog is hit though it's saved?
Yes, in Kankonian, you would change:

Wir teminen karaph kaluk yehade hakek wan.
we save+PAST dog before car hit+STAGNATIVE it

to:

Wir teminen karaph kaluk yehade haken wan.
we save+PAST dog before car hit+PAST it
Yeah, but saved from what?

In terms of pragmatics, it seems to me a strange distinction to make. Most translations this far have interpreted the sentence as "We saved the dog from being hit." -- which I would think is the regular pragmatic interpretation.

We saved the dog (from X?) and then a car hit it.


May make for an nice ironic O'Henry story, but do we arrange arguments this way grammatically in one sentence?
道可道,非常道
名可名,非常名

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Jackk
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Re: Before the car hit it

Post by Jackk » 09 Nov 2017 14:33

:con: Duban

Moc non o zouvu te paris cur cu yuc om ose.
put 1d.ex pfv dog from danger on time beat man 3s.an.obl
We saved the dog and then the man beat it.

Moc non o zouvu te paris cur cu yuc eppe om ose.
put 1d.ex pfv dog from danger on time beat irr man 3s.an.obl
We saved the dog before the man could beat it.
Eresse anga paris cur neduc, a san teonga.
The only thing more dangerous than doubt is certainty.

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Lao Kou
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Re: Before the car hit it

Post by Lao Kou » 16 Nov 2017 13:52

Image Géarthnuns

Trízh lé chö ngarebsöt, puskaushtanö che töths lé söböt haumergauz sho, amferöz.
1DUAL-NOM AUX.PAST DEF dog-ACC, before DEF car-NOM AUX.PAST 3SG-ACC hit-SPEC PTCL, save
We saved the dog before the car hit it.



Image Japoné語

私-autre oué on ga 救tta l'犬 au avant que le 車 ga l'au 轢lleta soéyeau.
Ouétachi-autre oué on ga soucoutta l'inou au avant que le courouma ga l'au hilleta soéyeau.
1PL TOP 1PL NOM save-PAST DEF=dog ACC before DEF car NOM 3SG=ACC hit-PAST be-SUBJ
We saved the dog before the car hit it.
道可道,非常道
名可名,非常名

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