Update on my Phonetics chart (wording on vowels)

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Taurenzine
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Update on my Phonetics chart (wording on vowels)

Post by Taurenzine » 06 Oct 2016 23:21

This is the second version of my phonetic chart. I'm working on symbols for it, and I think I have an idea of what I want to do. p.s, in the chart under the voiceless category, where it says (Not all are COMPLETELY Voiceless) I'm mostly referring to /tʃ/.

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Last edited by Taurenzine on 07 Oct 2016 21:53, edited 1 time in total.

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Axiem
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Re: Update on my Phonetics chart (wording on vowels)

Post by Axiem » 07 Oct 2016 00:30

This is more a UX/design consideration, rather than a comment on the sounds themselves, but that red is very striking. It ends up having the effect of calling attention to itself, rather to the surrounding text, creating an odd focal point around the empty cells in your chart. You'll notice that a lot of other charts around the internet (examples on Wikipedia: Valyrian, Swahili) either leave unused cells the same color as used cells, or subtly darken them, so the brighter cells get the focus. It helps draw the eye to the important data of the table, rather than the unimportant data. My recommendation would be (if you really want to color the cells) to use a soft grey, leaving the brighter white background behind used sounds as the foregrounding focus.
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Taurenzine
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Re: Update on my Phonetics chart (wording on vowels)

Post by Taurenzine » 07 Oct 2016 19:59

Axiem wrote:This is more a UX/design consideration, rather than a comment on the sounds themselves, but that red is very striking. It ends up having the effect of calling attention to itself, rather to the surrounding text, creating an odd focal point around the empty cells in your chart. You'll notice that a lot of other charts around the internet (examples on Wikipedia: Valyrian, Swahili) either leave unused cells the same color as used cells, or subtly darken them, so the brighter cells get the focus. It helps draw the eye to the important data of the table, rather than the unimportant data. My recommendation would be (if you really want to color the cells) to use a soft grey, leaving the brighter white background behind used sounds as the foregrounding focus.
Oh, sorry. Thanks, I'll fix that

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Re: Update on my Phonetics chart (wording on vowels)

Post by CrazyEttin » 07 Oct 2016 21:07

Where’s the first version? Also i’m genuinely confused by that classification (eg. /r/ as a stop), what is it based on?

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Re: Update on my Phonetics chart (wording on vowels)

Post by Taurenzine » 07 Oct 2016 21:57

CrazyEttin wrote:Where’s the first version? Also i’m genuinely confused by that classification (eg. /r/ as a stop), what is it based on?
First of all, if you want to see the first version you should have looked at my other posts before even sending this message, like seriously did you think it would be easier for you if I just linked it to you? I only have like 2 posts.

Second of all, /r/ could go into the fricatives (I'm not going to add another column other than fricatives, stops, and nasals because then it would make my written language more complicated. reasons as to why; I would say it but I'd like to work a bit more on my language before I post anything on that), and for that I thank you because I am now going to change my chart.

most of the classification in this chart is based off of what I would classify it as, and not by what the IPA classifies it as. I mean I'm making one language, I really shouldn't make it as complicated as the IPA chart, because that would be too complicated.

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Re: Update on my Phonetics chart (wording on vowels)

Post by CrazyEttin » 07 Oct 2016 22:44

Taurenzine wrote:
CrazyEttin wrote:Where’s the first version? Also i’m genuinely confused by that classification (eg. /r/ as a stop), what is it based on?
First of all, if you want to see the first version you should have looked at my other posts before even sending this message, like seriously did you think it would be easier for you if I just linked it to you? I only have like 2 posts.
Oh, it’s in another thread. But why make two for one subject?
Second of all, /r/ could go into the fricatives (I'm not going to add another column other than fricatives, stops, and nasals because then it would make my written language more complicated. reasons as to why; I would say it but I'd like to work a bit more on my language before I post anything on that), and for that I thank you because I am now going to change my chart.
So, a featural writing system? Those are always awesome, and it definitely explains the classification (although i’d suggest using "continuant" instead of "fricative", since that includes sonorants sucj as /j w/ as well). [:)]

(Also i’m not sure if there’s a term that covers both nasals and laterals, but if there isn’t there should be.)
most of the classification in this chart is based off of what I would classify it as, and not by what the IPA classifies it as. I mean I'm making one language, I really shouldn't make it as complicated as the IPA chart, because that would be too complicated.
Agreed. Some of the simplifications you made just seemed a bit odd before i knew about the writing system.

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Re: Update on my Phonetics chart (wording on vowels)

Post by Taurenzine » 07 Oct 2016 23:09

CrazyEttin wrote:
Taurenzine wrote:
CrazyEttin wrote:Where’s the first version? Also i’m genuinely confused by that classification (eg. /r/ as a stop), what is it based on?
First of all, if you want to see the first version you should have looked at my other posts before even sending this message, like seriously did you think it would be easier for you if I just linked it to you? I only have like 2 posts.
Oh, it’s in another thread. But why make two for one subject?
Second of all, /r/ could go into the fricatives (I'm not going to add another column other than fricatives, stops, and nasals because then it would make my written language more complicated. reasons as to why; I would say it but I'd like to work a bit more on my language before I post anything on that), and for that I thank you because I am now going to change my chart.
So, a featural writing system? Those are always awesome, and it definitely explains the classification (although i’d suggest using "continuant" instead of "fricative", since that includes sonorants sucj as /j w/ as well). [:)]

(Also i’m not sure if there’s a term that covers both nasals and laterals, but if there isn’t there should be.)
most of the classification in this chart is based off of what I would classify it as, and not by what the IPA classifies it as. I mean I'm making one language, I really shouldn't make it as complicated as the IPA chart, because that would be too complicated.
Agreed. Some of the simplifications you made just seemed a bit odd before i knew about the writing system.
Thanks for understanding to an extent. please also understand that I only really started getting into languages and conlangs a week or 2 after September started, so I really don't fully understand why certain IPA classification names are called what they are called, so I just do what I can.

and now that you mention it, your right it is weird that I've put this chart on a different topic. I'll move it over there.

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Re: Update on my Phonetics chart (wording on vowels)

Post by Nachtuil » 10 Oct 2016 06:56

This isn't too bad despite the terminology and grouping weirdness. I understand your reasoning that your language speakers would view their own language in such a regard as that certainly does happen and is valid. You should figure out next your vowels I think and start to think about phonotactics. Here is a decent video about it to get you started or at least intruduce you to a lot of the terminology: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Up5hSm7LYI

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Re: Update on my Phonetics chart (wording on vowels)

Post by Taurenzine » 11 Oct 2016 17:42

Nachtuil wrote:This isn't too bad despite the terminology and grouping weirdness. I understand your reasoning that your language speakers would view their own language in such a regard as that certainly does happen and is valid. You should figure out next your vowels I think and start to think about phonotactics. Here is a decent video about it to get you started or at least intruduce you to a lot of the terminology: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Up5hSm7LYI
Thank you so much this was really helpful [:D] I'll make sure to keep this in mind.

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Re: Update on my Phonetics chart (wording on vowels)

Post by Nachtuil » 14 Oct 2016 14:56

I am happy to help! I fully recommend listening to all of his linguistics videos actually.

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Re: Update on my Phonetics chart (wording on vowels)

Post by Egerius » 14 Oct 2016 17:43

Nachtuil wrote:I fully recommend listening to all of his linguistics videos actually.
I fully support that statement. Besides, his accent is just cool.
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